I realize that I'm making my very first post on this forum a semi-inflammatory one, but I still think this needs to be said... I raided 40 mans back in vanilla WoW, including Molten Core and Onyxia. A lot of people look back on those with fondness. While I did enjoy finally getting bosses down, I can safely say these were NOT the most epic experiences of my WoW career, and I'll explain why at the end of the following list... Six Reasons 40 mans aren't all they're cracked up to be 1. The primary purpose of such a large raid size was to slow endgame progression Endgame progression in vanilla WoW was sluggish, and it had to be because Blizzard wasn't exactly introducing new content to the game at breakneck speeds. Every raid boss in Molten Core dropped 3 pieces of loot, meaning that it would literally take months upon months to gear up everyone in the raid. Later, systems were added to the game to make this molasses-slow progression obsolete and completely unnecessary for the experience. 2. "Challenging" and "Tedious" are not the same thing 40 mans were difficult to manage by nature. This wasn't just because you were trying to get 40 people to march in the same direction. It was also because, the more people in a raid, the more things that could possibly go wrong. Was it fun to wipe because one healer screwed up and let a tank go down or because one tank missed a taunt? Player error aside, when a single player in a 40 man had internet connection issues, it could mean the other 39 players were going to suffer for it. At some point, it's no longer a question of "challenge" but simple bad luck. It wasn't fun then and it's not going to be fun now when a raid wipes because an esper misses a skillshot heal on a tank. Just hope that the devs aren't fond of "make or break" mechanics that all players must avoid or the raid wipes: All it takes is 1 person in 40 to have a lag spike at the wrong time and it's GG. 3. Particle effects...X40! All too often, 40 man raiding was more of a test to see whose computer was beefy enough to handle it than individual player skill. That aside, what happens when we miss telegraphs because you're standing in a large group of players and cannot even SEE the ground? 4. 40 may as well be 100, or 1,000 Unless the folks at Carbine are going to be extremely clever, there's another problem with 40 man raids that will persist in Wildstar: There is never a time when any one player is going to be interacting with the other 39 members of the group. Think about it: Healers are assigned to tanks, tanks are assigned to bosses or off-tanking, DPS are assigned to specific adds. The portion of the fight you're individually going to be assigned to will likely be a subset of a bigger fight, and that means the rest of the fight is barely in your periphery, let alone the players taking part in it. Even in gigantic 40 person tank-n-spanks, you'll have a hard time convincing me that you couldn't subtract 20 players and 50% of the boss' health and not have the exact same experience. 5. Less like a guild, more like a corporation Assembling and maintaining a 40 man raid is a herculean task, but one of the bigger perils of doing so is the risk of the raid splintering. The larger the raid, the more informal the overall experience will be (more on this later) and the easier it for players to walk away, lured by another guild with the promise of better loot. In fact, vanilla WoW's 40 man raids were notorious for giving rise to a system where players used guilds as stepping stones to better guilds, and "headhunter" guilds were perfectly happy to steal the best-geared members from each other. The end result was an endgame that felt a lot more like a job market and raiding that felt like a day at the office: Show up with bunch of strangers at the same time and place, do your job, don't be disruptive, then get paid (usually in DKP). Even the biggest, most successful raiding guilds always seemed to succumb to splintering and fell apart in the end. 6. No one has 39 REAL friends As I mentioned at the beginning of the post, I raided in 40 mans in vanilla WoW, but I can safely say that the absolute most EPIC raid experience I ever had was when we finally downed Ragnaros...in Firelands with my 10 man when I returned to WoW years later. Why? Because I knew these 9 people. I LIKED these 9 people. Unlike the hulking roster of 40 from vanilla, I enjoyed the company of every person in this raid. When we finally achieved victory over Rags, it was something we could all celebrate together because we hadn't just done it as a group of 10 players but a group of 10 FRIENDS. Ultimately, we play MMOs for the social connections we make, and 40 man raids don't exactly foster socialization. Aside from the fact that everyone needs to be silent so the raid leader can be heard, there's not much point in growing too attached to any of your co-workers because the odds of them leaving for a better job are fairly high. When I raided with a 10 man, I was able to do so with people I liked. Odds are, players raiding in a 40 man are going to be doing so with at least one player they DON'T like, and forcing players to deal with people they hate for the sake of progression is the first step toward encouraging players to ask themselves "Is this worth it?". In conclusion, I feel that 40 mans are the wrong way to go. Aside from them being laggy and conflicting with WildStar's own mechanics, aside from the fact that the number of players has little relevance on your own personal experience, aside from the "job market" they give rise to, a 40 man raid doesn't help in the one thing every MMO should be trying to do for it's playerbase: Give them a group of FRIENDS they'll want to play the game with for years to come.