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Carbine's 'Hardcore' attitude...

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Cesmode, Sep 20, 2013.

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  1. Malorak

    Malorak Cupcake-About-Town

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    ...Wow. Really?

    Why hasn't there ANY footage of crafting yet?
    Or the 2 new classes?
    Ex.1?
    Ex.2?
    Ex.3?
    Or you know...Leveling? The thing you need to do before raiding?
    Or attunement? The thing you need to do before you can raid?

    The list goes on, pal. They want to stretch the hype a little longer since the release will be early 2014, just makes sense to...Well, stretch it over time instead of saying the same stuff again and again.

    That's an illogical way to argue IMO. Carbine stated that they're finished with all of the content and are just polishing it etc.

    CBT didn't go to maxlevel, that's a fact. Why should they release raid content into this when they haven't even shown the last few zones? Lol.

    "Hey, here's this super cool content but you won't see how to reach it." <--Best idea ever 10/10

    It's also been stated that they will show raid and Veteran(Heroic/whatever) dungeon content, but in a logical order. If you don't even know what to do to get to raiding how can you know it's good? Well, logical assumptions may say "leveling from 1-20 was fun->until endgame must be cool too" but who knows? Maybe you need to balance a bunch of cabbages on top of each other...

    While a poor cabbage seller yells that there are his and that you should stop?
  2. AcidBaron

    AcidBaron "That" Cupcake

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    Raid content hasn't been shown because it hasn't been tested yet by players, Carbine isn't in the market of showing stuff before they are comfortable with it.

    Or you can believe a random tinfoil hat theory by people who try to force their own wishes on how they game should be, not sure why people like grim are still here, but hey some people also like sadism, whatever floats his boat i guess.

    As for the OP, the game is designed to train people up from the get go. You'll need to put effort in but there will also be things to do for those with less time. More words i'm not going to waste on that.
  3. Arkay

    Arkay Cupcake

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    Well, I didn't read much of the thread but in response to the OP. I get your fears but no. Nothing is worse than having content that doesn't challenge players for long. Tune for the top players and don't nerf content. This is the only way to keep them really having fun. As for others who 'can't do it'. There really isn't such a thing as 'I can't do this'. If you have a pulse, the will and the ability to learn then you can eventually do anything that even the best players can do. The only people who truly can't are the ones who give up.

    Your post kind of disgusts me honestly. What ever happened to striving for that sense of accomplishment when you got screwed by the game, overcame your limits and leveled up your ability? I hope they stick to their guns and provide a truly engaging game experience. Lazy people can do other, less painful things. Casuals and Hardcore players who wish to advance can climb through the mud. I personally find this approach to game design enjoyable.
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  4. atom

    atom Cupcake-About-Town

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    You know what I do when I find a game that looks good, but I don't like the direction the devs are taking? I don't play it.


    I know, I just blew your mind. You don't have to play games that don't cater to your carebear desires and gimmegimmegimmenownownow.

    Seriously though. Why do all the casual filth who don't want a hardcore game, migrate to a game that devs have openly said is for the hardcore? They've told you, on numerous occasions, that the game probably isn't for you, so why are you here? I don't understand the thought process of that group of people. You are essentially trying to rape this game of its soul. Every time they tell you "No!" that they don't want to cater to your casualness you think it means "Yes! More! Gimme more!" and thrust your ridiculousness into their face over, and over, and over again.

    Why?

    *Note: You, you're, and your are not representative of any single person, but a group of intellectual neophytes as a whole.
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  5. Arkay

    Arkay Cupcake

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    I feel like if WildStar truly does make the game 'hardcore', punishing, and all together brutal... it will appeal to more people. My best experiences with others were in older MMO. Games that were unfair, grueling, inaccessible, and overall took a lot of time and effort to move forward.

    What did this do? It beat people down. Why was it so good? Maybe people are inherently masochistic but I feel like the reason has to do with the act of overcoming that hurdle. Powering through those tests with your perseverance and the relationships you -had- to have formed with others. This made the communities special as a result. Everytime you get beat down but stand back up becomes some kind of drug that just compounds your addiction.
    Carebear Commander likes this.
  6. teh_ninjaneer

    teh_ninjaneer Cupcake-About-Town

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    I raided both ZG and AQ20 in my tier0.5 priest banana suit, not "good gear from MC/BWL." Does that make me a hero?

    Or maybe "hardcore"?
  7. John

    John "That" Cupcake

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    Smaller raids are more popular because they are easier to organize, thats all.
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  8. Grytswyrm

    Grytswyrm Cupcake

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    I can't edit my chart post for some reason, but I'd like to add that those %'s are also lower than what they truly should be because alt guilds increase the total amount of guilds that the % is comparing it to.
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  9. TeoH

    TeoH Well-Known Cupcake

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    You agree that they're more popular then?
  10. SykoTavo

    SykoTavo Cupcake

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    Smartest thing said here yet.

    Casuals don't want easier things, they want more accessible things.

    True, making things easy also makes them more accessible but the opposite is not true.

    If you pursue exclusivity by time, many skilled players will be excluded.

    If you pursue exclusivity by skill, only bad players will be exclude
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  11. atom

    atom Cupcake-About-Town

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    Are you suggesting that the most completed instance is by default the most popular choice?
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  12. Kash

    Kash Cupcake

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    I disagree with your statement that it's not the right thing to say. I don't raid. I played wow for over 7 years before I quit. I think the dumbing down and making the hardest content available to everyone was a poor decision. While I understand the reasoning behind it, I believe it has resulted in a generation of gamer that expects everything to be handed to them without having to work for it.

    I hope Carbine sticks to their guns about not nerfing contents to make it easily available to everyone. If that means there are areas of the game I don't see cause I don't raid, so be it.
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  13. Cesmode

    Cesmode Cupcake-About-Town

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    Misunderstood what I meant. I think the dev was a bit too brash and blunt with what he said. Not very professional. Makes it seem like a bunch of frat boys work at Carbine.

    I agree with not nerfing anything.
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  14. Ugh

    Ugh Cupcake

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    Didn't read through all of this because I should be sleeping, 3rd shifter. All I really wanted to say is that if the content isn't hard enough there is no feeling of epicness when you finally down a boss you've been working on. I'm hoping to see more leroy jenkins videos from wildstar personally. Group of friends having to plan out precisely what to do against hardcore content. Abdool giving a quick number crunch. Then Leroyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Jenkinssssssssss. At least he has chicken though.


    Bottom line, raids need to be hard to feel significant and give a feeling of epicness.


    I foresee great things.
  15. Kash

    Kash Cupcake

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    Ah my apologies then. But Gaffney isn't a dev. He's the head honcho.
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  16. Cull

    Cull New Cupcake

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    I personally like the way they respond to things. The folks at carbine on here, in interviews, and on twitter often reply like real people giving their honest opinion, as blunt brash and unfiltered as they would in a real conversation. Not as if everything they say is a script approved by corporate to coddle the masses. I find it refreshing.
  17. Malorak

    Malorak Cupcake-About-Town

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    I do not like your choice of words as in "casual filth" but I do agree.

    This game's made by hardcore gamers FOR hardcore gamers. The end.
    "Dieses Problem ist uns bekannt". <--German standart speaking of GM's saying that the problem's known.

    "...And?"

    "Any other questions, [player]?"

    "Your macro didn't quite work there."

    "Wonderful, then I wish you a great day in the world of warcraft!"
  18. Xecks

    Xecks Cupcake-About-Town

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    i think that hard stuff is like a carrot that we all chase. people see that challenge and want to do their best to complete it. it just matters how "hardcore" it is . if it is too hard for any but the best to ever have a hope to do, and even people who are of a lower skill level mildly it will be too hard and thus be a fail.
    im all for hard content. i just want to have a chance to actually complete it. if it is too hard and only 1% is able to complete it not as many people will stay and bang their head. eventually people have to catch the carrot for game designers to just replace that carrot with a new shinier carrot .
    hard but not impossible is the best way to be.
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  19. TeoH

    TeoH Well-Known Cupcake

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    I'm not getting involved with the general topic of the thread, as I think the OP's post is pure sillyness borne out of reading too far into a vague press statement.

    However I know John's stance on the raid size topic that he's commenting on, so his one-liner has an implied argument behind it and i'm replying with my own equally backhanded one-liner implication.

    So here's the thing - There is nothing wrong with a game mode being easy to organise, and there is certainly nothing wrong with a game mode being popular. So when you point out that something is 'only' popular because it is accessible, in a diminishing tone, what you are actually trying to suggest is that despite it being accessible, and despite it being popular, it is in some way inferior to the alternative because it is mainstream or 'casual friendly'.

    This is about to derail into an argument about raid sizes. Nothing of value will be lost.
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  20. Malorak

    Malorak Cupcake-About-Town

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    "1%" is such a stupid phrase.
    Just ignore it. Forever. Seriously, this is only a term because back in Vanilla lots of people joined when BWL came out and had to level up first and grow accustomed to such a new world.

    Lots of people cleared Karazhan and some SSC and TK, yes, only a few did BT and SWP but...Well, that's how it was.

    Impossible should never be the target here - hard is what we're aiming for. And I want it hard. Ooooh yeah.
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