1. Hey Guest! If you're more than just a WildStar fan and want to keep up on the latest MMO news, reviews and opinion pieces then I'd like to suggest you visit our sister site MMO Central

Elder Game / Raid gear and how to not make raids mandatory for non raiders

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Fownie, Jul 31, 2013.

  1. Fownie

    Fownie New Cupcake

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2013
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I was thinking about the 1% Raid base that wildstar is aiming for, and how to make non raiders not feel "wimpered" because of prefering content like Elder Game, and i thought, if Raiding is all about grouping why not make a special stat for raiding gear? for example:

    "Synergy" : A stat that only raiding gear has. It will be shown as the amount of all the synergy of the whole group . Synergy improves the main "stat" of each class by a certain amount.

    This will solve 2 things:

    - People that likes doing single player content won't feel like they need raiding to obtain better gear for their objectives since raiding gear will have similar stats than "solo" gear of the same tier but with the extra synergy stat.

    - When a raider obtains a new piece of gear not only the raider but the whole group will be empowered.
    Gronky likes this.
  2. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Likes Received:
    1,090
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Hit already fills that role in other games. Getting hit capped is beyond trivial for any non raid content, as such all of that stat budget is effectively wasted. For soloing its as effective as pvp gear in that way.
  3. Ico

    Ico Moderator • WSC's Gentle Flower

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    586
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    UK

    Personally I don't like the idea of having an additional stat to add differences to gear. I can wrap my head around the a PvP because the combat styles are radically different between PvE and PvP. However, by adding this stat you take the power out of raid gear for when they want to solo which equally isn't as fair to the raiders who've spent time getting this gear.

    As long as the solo players get rewards that allow them to complete the solo content without hitting gear walls, I don't see much of an issue, I'm not saying they shouldn't be rewarded with cool looking gear, or that they should have terrible stats. With all my cards on the table, if your not raiding then you simply shouldn't get the best PvE gear, but that's my opinion.
    αRomeo, Mierelle and Xalon like this.
  4. Fownie

    Fownie New Cupcake

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2013
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Those responses are all from a "WOW" perspective, but what if Elder Game mechanics where harder than the ones a raider has to face? In Wildstar raiding is only 1 of the engame contents.
    Gronky likes this.
  5. Roguehandle

    Roguehandle Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Huh? Forcing PvE players to do raids just to continue doing PvE stuff with better PvE gear?

    Sorry. That does not make any sense to me..:)
  6. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Likes Received:
    1,090
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Not really. Hit as a stat does that in several other games also. Really though, do you want to turn this into yet another thread of "solo'ers are better than raiders and deserve better/same loot!"? There are literally 50 other threads for that.
    Ianpact and Xalon like this.
  7. Ico

    Ico Moderator • WSC's Gentle Flower

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    586
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    UK

    No, my belief is that solo content will give you the gear you need to do solo content at the correct scaling difficulty. But Raid gear should be straight up better.

    There's no forcing going on at all, if users don't want to do group content in the first place they don't need the better gear from group content. As long as solo gear gives you want you need and gives you an attractive aesthetic from completing the solo story/adventures, what else do they need?
    Ianpact, Fuzedknight, Xalon and 3 others like this.
  8. Roguehandle

    Roguehandle Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Can we all just get along?

    Solo'ers are not better than raiders and raiders are not better than Solo'ers. Each person is different. Each person has a different play style. It would not be fair just to have solo content and not give the raiders their chance to test their skills and play with others. Also, it would not be fair penalizing the solo group for not wanting to do raids.

    Carbine is the chief. Combining all these different ingredients in the right amount and giving the game a great flavor will only help and enhance the game.
  9. Xalon

    Xalon Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2013
    Likes Received:
    35
    Trophy Points:
    28
    No. The skins I get from doing hard out difficult raids should not be equal to someone who does quests, or even the stats. Thats where GW2 massively goes wrong, gear. I know all the casuals in that game complain about other MMORPG's gear treadmill but theres almost no incentive to run most of the dungeons in the game because the gear is ridiculously easy to get
  10. Ico

    Ico Moderator • WSC's Gentle Flower

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    586
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    UK

    I'm not arguing against solo-players, nor am I saying raiding players are better, or even for that matter that PvP players are better. People play how they want to play and that's brilliant, I also like how Carbine are incentivising it through Solo stories and solo Elder game content. However, you can't expect to get equal rewards from the two, it makes little to no sense that someone would come out of killing "THE UNIVERSE DESTROYER" wielding the fallen bosses' appendages would then have to switch to a blue/purple solo weapon they got in order to kill anything outside of the raid.

    As I say as long as the solo'ers get "elder" gear that looks good and has the stats to allow them to move through the episodic content with a fair difficulty I don't know why it would matter to them?
    Xalon likes this.
  11. Roguehandle

    Roguehandle Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    So, Raid gear should be better than PvE gear when in a raid but horrible in PvE and PvE gear should be horrible in a raid but better than raid when in PvE?

    Or since raiders raid they are the best people and should get the best gear and everyone else is scum because of their playstyle?

    *shakes head sadly*
    Gronky and Livnthedream like this.
  12. AusterlitZ

    AusterlitZ Well-Known Cupcake

    Joined:
    May 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    315
    Trophy Points:
    63
    WildStar is a game made for raiders,period,raiders will have the best gear because Carbine designed the game with them at the top of the food-chain,you don't like it,then WS is not the game for you.
    FairyTailisBack likes this.
  13. Ico

    Ico Moderator • WSC's Gentle Flower

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    586
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    UK
    That's not what's been said at all. I'm happy and even eager to discuss how solo players could be better accommodated and rewarded fairly. But when it comes to PvE difficulty, nothing compares to raiding, even Carbine have said it's some of the most brutal content they've ever seen made, players should be rewarded based on the difficulty of that content.

    Hell I might be wrong, the game comes out and there's some sort of adventuring stat for Solo gear to stop Raid gear trivialising the solo adventures.
  14. Zellfel

    Zellfel Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2013
    Likes Received:
    139
    Trophy Points:
    43

    There is no distinction, raid gear is PvE gear as raiding is group oriented PvE. You're turning this into a class war when it doesn't need to be (raiders vs. non-raiders). Raid gear is tailored to allow the members of the raid to defeat raid bosses. This is usually better gear than outside of raids because raid bosses require more coordination and are generally tougher than mobs anywhere else in the game.

    In other MMOs, raid bosses outscale anything you can do in solo content, therefore the raiders need to be properly equipped. This game is proposing content for multiple play styles, but at the same time the appropriate rewards for the content. If the raid content is the toughest pve content in the game, then you can guarantee that it will get the better gear because it deserves it. Does it mean that other gameplay styles are left out in the cold? No. Does it mean they will get equivalent gear to the people doing the hardest content in the game? Of course not. Will they get gear that allows them to play their play style effectively? Absolutely.
    Mellkor, Vaos, Afrotech and 2 others like this.
  15. CaRaDaGaiTa

    CaRaDaGaiTa Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2013
    Likes Received:
    150
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Thanks to Sword Art Online, now everyone wants to be a Kirito, solo player...
    Fuzedknight and Gronky like this.
  16. Darkhors3

    Darkhors3 Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2013
    Likes Received:
    12
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Wallasey

    I believe war plots are 40man encounters in pvp and I think the gear from that is on the same level as high end raiding gear but ofc one gear is for pvp the other pve..
    Kataryna likes this.
  17. Roguehandle

    Roguehandle Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Oh...I have been a solo player since Ultima Online...:)

    I get everyone's point. Raiders work together for the harder content/raiders and should be rewarded.

    Its just the attitude some raiders have when it comes to people who enjoy PvE.

    "You don't raid...Noob!"

    Yea...:)
  18. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Likes Received:
    1,090
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Solo players have that same attitude, as does many pvpers, and a great many rpers etc.
    Fuzedknight and Xevius like this.
  19. Roguehandle

    Roguehandle Cupcake

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2013
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Well, people who do that need to be feed to a Chua..:)

    Topic: Carbine stated it will be for all play styles. Raids and PvP will be there, just like PvE. The game was not just made for raiders..:)
  20. Zellfel

    Zellfel Cupcake-About-Town

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2013
    Likes Received:
    139
    Trophy Points:
    43

    Yeah, unfortunately that's just people on the internet. Do you remember when trolling was actually looked down upon by the majority of the internet? Pepperidge Farm remembers.

    On topic: Actually, there's one thing people might be overlooking: Set Bonuses. Why not allow solo content to award its own gear with its own set bonuses that kind of empowers them for solo content a little? Like a set bonus that has a chance to proc a heal. It could provide some interesting set bonus mixtures in raids and soloers actually get the same feeling of getting stronger?
    Ianpact likes this.

Share This Page