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Enough dungeons in wildstar?

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Jdielas, Sep 5, 2013.

  1. Amayasu

    Amayasu Cupcake

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    4-6 *is* too low in my opinion. Sorry, but it is.

    It's not about branching paths or difficulty, it's about variation. 4-6 dungeons feels restrictive; environment plays a huge part in experience, and just because you can have different mechanics, the setting remains the same.

    Adventures? We know nothing about them, but, given that they they've been classified differently, they're not dungeons. Maybe they're instanced group quests, or something all together different, we don't know yet, so i'm happy to wait and see...

    FFXIV has a surprising number of dungeons. Better yet, they're varied, story-relevent and (mostly) good quality. Everybody runs them, because in order to progress, you have to. I've enjoyed discovering them. Add to that FFXIV's Guildhests (initially simple, progressively more complex, instanced content with a singular goal, that teaches instancing, group play and raiding concepts), and the three Trials (essentially an early glimpse Raid bosses to get people familiar with the idea of beating the Primals) and FFXIV has a ton of instanced content...

    ... and you know what else? I see and know people running them who would never, traditionally, be into dungeons and raids.

    Warplots, Raids; great for guilds. It's cool to say W* has a ton of solo content, that's great for the people who may as well be playing a single player game with the occasional co-op... but what about those players who like group play, at end-game, with PuGs? Their existence is "sit in a major city, queue up, tank/heal/pew on of the 4-6 instances"... rinse, repeat. That's already a thing in other MMOs, and it's already terrible.
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  2. BlindSear

    BlindSear Super Cupcake

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    They've said that Adventures are 2-3 hour stints of group PvE content (between 2-5 players I believe). So, anyone who would be satisfied as having dungeons as their "end game" would probably be satisfied similarly by Adventures. We don't know exactly how hard they will be or anything yet, or what the content is exactly, but I feel like if you only play MMORPG's to do dungeons and never actually raid, that there needs to be a different content available for you. I think they've mentioned adventures have you travelling across the open world, as well as having some instanced things.

    Additionally, instanced content is bad for PUG groups, because you're grouping up to get away from people. If your thing is pugging, having the ability to dynamically add and remove people from your group would be better. So, I'm hoping instead of making more dungeons for those players, that Carbine adds open world content instead to fill that gap. As you stated, it's terrible that players simply just queue in town all day long and that's it.

    I think that dungeons should be used as a stepping stone to raiding, and short content stents for skilled players. If that's the case, it's nice that there are less dungeons, because gearing for raiding will be shortened. While there are players who only do dungeons, they generally have a higher goal in mind and would prefer to be doing raiding or something like that, but have logistical problems getting into a team.

    So, as you said, we'll have to wait and see about adventures, but additionally, we'll have to see about how they handle open world content and other content we may not have heard about.
  3. Haversham

    Haversham Cupcake-About-Town

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    Ahhh, I can't take it anymore Blind! A stent is a tube that's inserted into blood vessels to keep them from collapsing or to hold them open when clogged. A stint (which is what you want to say here) is a small amount of someone's times, usually referring to them actively doing something.

    Sorry :D
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  4. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    4 Dungeons and 6 Adventures = 10 sets of group content. Level cap is 50. Theoretically we will see a new dungeon every 5 levels.

    My thoughts are not the leveling dungeons / adventures but the elder game group content.

    One of the great parts about vanilla wow was that variety in dungeons at level 50.

    I would like to think that these 10 instances will be viable at 50 but if not I would really hope to see more group content.

    When my friends and I play if we're not doing PvP we like to troll around in a dungeon together. We'll need variety.
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  5. elnerdino

    elnerdino New Cupcake

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    If I recall correctly, you have to be lvl 17 for the first dungeon so
    (50-17)lvl/10GrpContent = 1 "Group Content" every 3.3lvls - which sounds great to me
    even if you just count "Dungeons" you still have
    (50-17)lvl/4Dungeons = 1 Dungeon every 8.25lvls - which isn't to shabby either, I think.
    Of course assuming the Grp-Content/Dungeons are spread evenly.

    In addition, no one really knows how long lvling will take, so maybe the time between dungeons (and/or adventures) is still smaller than we are used to in other MMOs. All we can do at the moment is wait for release (or CB4, if they drop the NDA) or pray to the Elden to give us some insight on their plans :D
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  6. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    ^^ very true you don't start off at lvl 1 . So yes we'll see them packed together a little better.
  7. BlindSear

    BlindSear Super Cupcake

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    Fixed! Still doesn't change the argument...
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  8. Haversham

    Haversham Cupcake-About-Town

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    Nope, not one bit :)
  9. dizko

    dizko Cupcake-About-Town

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    I have to admit that this is one of the few things I'm worried about. I'll have to wait and see what these adventure things are, but 4-6 dungeons seems like a small amount to have to level up with.
  10. Vossler

    Vossler Cupcake

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    I'm not worried because leveling up through dungeons is the most boring thing ever. Running them at max level for gear is awesome, but I will never run places over and over and over just to level up. 6 hardmode lvl 50 dungeons sounds great to me and if adventures are just as big big then even better.
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  11. Pejo

    Pejo Cupcake-About-Town

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    So you're willing to run the heroic dungeons to progress your character, but you're not willing to run the dungeons to progress your character??! Color me confused. Is it because there is an alternative to dungeons as you level? There also going to have a solo progression model at max level, why not just use that instead? Doesn't really make sense how one form is boring even though you're doing exactly the same thing, and achieving exactly the same thing.
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  12. Deloim

    Deloim Cupcake

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    Just optimism for more content.
    It allows more immersive and interesting storylines behind the dungeons if there is a continuum and by attunements I mean that doing even the normal instances in an order gives a better fullfilment for those who like to do them. There is not a lot of things that can ruin a rpg game like making things convinient for players. It usually leads to trivializing the content.

    Anyway I see no point in achies if you dont have to actually do something for them and get ingame vanity rewards off it. Clearing a dungeon should not be one. Just trash that system blizzard uses to "grade" them with points, what you got should matter more than how many.

    Man how you managed to twist that into something so nefarious. Good job, lol. : DD
  13. BlindSear

    BlindSear Super Cupcake

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    There's a difference though. If you're doing dungeons to level it's because the xp/hour is optimized for your efforts. This is the case especially the first time you do a dungeon, and it has all the quests in it to boost your xp. After that it usually doesn't have the same incentives, so it's only useful for tanks/healers who refuse to dps spec.

    If you're doing a dungeon at max level it's usually because you're aiming to do something else beyond the dungeon. Usually raiding. That means you're using the dungeon strictly to get gear, and there's no other option for you to do so (to an extent). This means that during the levelling process you have options, and if you choose not to use them, it does get monotonous re-running the same content until cap, but at max level you're forced to do them, due to lack of options.

    The other issue with dungeons are, that when levelling you'll replace the gear you get fairly quickly anyway, so it is just the experience you get. When the game originally launches no one can be bored of doing the zones, as they haven't done them yet, so the lee-way they'll have for levelling dungeons will be much more, especially because they're implementing viable options for support classes. I agree that it's weird that he thought gearing at max level was "awesome" but otherwise it somewhat makes sense, but I think he was speaking to this point, that it's unnecessary to have a variety of levelling dungeons, as you could be spending your time elsewhere.
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  14. Vossler

    Vossler Cupcake

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    You're not achieving exactly the same thing. Anything you do in those places while leveling will be voided out within a few levels via gear. So I have no idea why you're confused that I would rather not waste my game time doing something over and over for zero reason.
  15. Vossler

    Vossler Cupcake

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    P.S. getting gear is awesome, it's pretty much the main point of playing any MMO!!!!!
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  16. Roadblock

    Roadblock Cupcake-About-Town

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    You could have fooled me :p
    In most my guilds we call people that only care about their shinies lootwh0res.
    At the first sign of loot drama they're the first getting the boot, makes for much more pleasant gaming for the rest of us.

    Gear is a means to an end.
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  17. Uggen

    Uggen New Cupcake

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    Good point. And just to make it even more positive, it's not 17-50, it's 17-49! :) One level less to take into calculations ^^ Cause when your 50, you will be switching to 50 dungeons. Which would enable you to go through a new adventure/dungeon every 3.2 levels. 3.2≈every third level. That's not bad.
  18. Vossler

    Vossler Cupcake

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    Lootwhores are just people that feel entitled to something over someone else and if they leave it's better for any guild or group. Still though everyone likes loot, no point in playing if you never get anything new. No matter how long it takes you're there for a few reasons one of which is to make your character the best it can be and in MMOs that is mostly LOOT!
  19. Gunghoe

    Gunghoe Cupcake-About-Town

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    why would gaffer say that there is 5 to 6 dungeons to level up in, and then more after? 2 to 3 dungeons in the adventures, what will the adventures be? Now basically, adventures must be something more epic than I once assumed. Hopefully they are indeed epic. 4 dungeons. 3 of them will be for veteran run through, one entirely new. So is adventure also going to be hard? or are we supposed to complete those with a "pulse" or just a little more attention? Really seems like the plague that strikes with any dynamic game, is it's content seems rather limited at first glance. and to some people Repeating the same content over and over again to get to the gear they need to progress may make the game somewhat bland.... here is hoping to adventures, if there is only 4 main dungeons.

    We need more of an idea of what adventures are! With out a dev speak. can you elaborate on what those adventures are? are they a great means of getting gear at End game, or are they for the easier crowd to play. If they are for the easier crowd, then stick to your guns and make the four dungeons epic and hard for the end game. Though i'd suspect we are going to have to have Faith in order for us to see what will be in the first or second content update.

    We also have people beta testing this game, one thing to consider is that if there is indeed too little content, will they delay to have more dungeons, and more stuff to do while leveling? To me at this point Housing is becoming a loss leader for making other content. If they chose to not have housing would the other content be more robust? would the art and asset team have had a better focus on dungeons.

    Final fantasy has more "bosses made to a group activity" but really there is a few real dungeons. Rift had like 7 or 8 dungeons for max level 4 of wich progressed you to the next 4, then to raiding. It all depends on how they update this game, for me to subscribe any longer than 2-3 months. 4 dungeons, and 1 20 man raid and 1 40 man raid will be fine for launch but if they remain at that for too long the game will have a dwindling player-base before we know it. I really hope they ain't exagerating with how long it takes to get to max level 150-250 hours depending on how they will tool the content.

    I Do not want to be waiting for content, I want to be playing content. I want the game to have enough for the majority of people to play for 2-3 months. Sure there will be exploiters, that get to end game in a week. But for the legit playing 150+ hours will take me 2 -3 months to consume if do not no life it.

    At this point, it almost makes me think the content will be spread to thin because of how much variety there is. Let's hope this is not the case. because if the adventures give the feeling there is no reason to do the veteran mode, if there is one, then why have them. They can not possibly be for the casual audience, because they are claimed to be about twice as long as a dungeon. Casual players are typically casual, not because of skill but because of time.

    dungeons are 1-1.5 hours
    i hear that adventures are 2-3 hours. Will adventures at end game, be nearly or as rewarding as dungeons? why would the progression based person do them, if there is no better or equal loot there?

    Solo dungeons :? crafting/lore/ just below tier 1
    Adventures :6 = tier 1/ crafting
    5-man dungeons :4 Tier 1 / crafting
    10-man raids :1 tier 1.5 / crafting
    20 man raids :1 tier 2

    IF at end game adventures and 5 man give similar gear equipment, then all would be good.

    With it requiring more time played to complete than 5 man dungeons, then how else would they get people to do them? when solo dungeons are for the lore, and what is currently happening to the game?
  20. Castia

    Castia New Cupcake

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    This is a worry for me if im honest, 4 dungeons really isn't enough especially when 3 of them can be done while leveling up.

    A lot rides on adventures now, they really need to be good to fill the void left by the lack of dungeons.

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