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Experience Bars and You

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by snappyllama, Aug 24, 2012.

  1. snappyllama

    snappyllama Cupcake

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    • What does everyone think of non-quest-driven leveling paths?
    • Should you get experience from gathering things, pvp, crafting, and exploring?
    • Should you be able to skip questing altogether? Would it detract from your game if other people did?
    • What *really* constitutes experience?
    • How have you seen this work/fail in other games?
    • What is a good time investment for each level and to get to endgame?
    Discuss.
  2. Dyraele

    Dyraele "That" Cupcake

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    1) I like the idea, though I still like quests. There should be a mixture. To a point, there already are non-quest leveling paths which include killing things, exploring areas of the map, etc. The more diversity the better.
    2) In general, no to all if it applies to char level but yes for skill levels.
    3) Yes. No.
    4) Good question and one that has bugged me for a long time. Will explain in the last bullet.
    5) WOW/SWTOR and maybe other gave you XP for finding new areas of the map. While I get the idea of this I would like it better if it applied in a different manner, as in a skill that increases.
    6) I am going to get a lot of hate mail for this one. I don't think levels should take different amounts of time. If it takes me 20 hours to get the last max level, it should take me 20 hours to get the first level. Furthermore, I would like to see like maybe 5 levels total. 0 - beginner, 1 - novice, 2 - experienced, 3 - master, 4 - grand master.
    Something along those lines. How you get these levels are all based on the different skills you have and how good you are in them. Exploring, crafting, swordsmanship, gathering, lollipop licking, all the good skills you need to be an adventurer. Let people get satisfaction from the leveling of skills intead of char level. Character level in and of itself does not make sense to me. It is the skills a person has that determines how well they perform in a given situation. I realize this would be much harder to do and harder to group people together for things like raids and dungeons, but it would make it so a person needs to be more well rounded to get to the next character level.
  3. Tiktak

    Tiktak Cupcake-About-Town

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    • I like questing, other people don't. I don't see why they should be forced to quest to level up...
    • I don't see why they shouldn't.
    • Yes. No I don't mind.
    • Doing things in game :p Killing mobs, completing quests, exploring the world and the lore behind it, making things...pretty much anything your character can do in game, really.
    • The Elder Scrolls games. Everything you did levelled up as you did it. Slowly.
    • I agree each level should take the same amount of time to work through. I'd say a few hours each 2-3 maybe. It should take a while to get to max level if only to give the devs time to start the next section of content after the current lot is farmed to death.
  4. Kirathis

    Kirathis Cupcake-About-Town

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    I am not a fan of someone sitting in a town and doing a ton of other activities to get to the same combat level that I did for going out and busting my butt on constant deaths. Those activities can also often be automated through the use of add-ons, macros and programmable keyboard driven events. Not exactly fair to have someone automate a quick level in 2 weeks while watching tv when it takes someone who is questing and fighting 6 months to attain the same level.

    If they want to have another system where someone does not level combat but levels into a town based merchant type of activity that would be a bit interesting. Of course that would probably mean that the quester/adventurer types would never have as much money as the sit at the town types but who knows. It would be interesting if they could come up with something like that to offer an entirely different type of system but meh.
  5. Dyraele

    Dyraele "That" Cupcake

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    I just found a game by coincidence that has the following:

    • No Levels
    • Skills based gameplay which features 75 unique skills, and 14 tiers within each skill line.
    • Players are not forced into combat roles. Crafting, harvesting, diplomatic or other non-combat oriented skills can operate and progress independently of combat.
    • Skills increase automatically through use. Abilities are earned and not given automatically.
    • Skill Imprinting system allows you to imprint knowledge of skills into yourself, to make up for time lost while doing activities such as missions.
    Sounds somewhat like what I was talking about and what the topic is about.
  6. SirRobin

    SirRobin Cupcake-About-Town

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    Personally I enjoyed Skyrim's system a lot more than I expected too. I hit someone with a sword a lot? My sword skill gets better. I want to improve a kind of spell? I get the spell and start using it. I don't mind having "levels" per se but I would prefer them for the skill being used instead of the character as a whole. Of course balancing such a system would probably be one hell of a nightmare.
    SiegaPlays likes this.
  7. SiegaPlays

    SiegaPlays "That" Cupcake

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    1. I like to be able to make a change of tune now and then, so I do like having other options than just questing. With the 20% path quests I do think WildStar will have replay value that lasts longer than the usual. I do like diffent types of content approach having their own levels, like crafting, adventuring and pvp being 3 different systems.

    2. Yes. In WoW I really appreciate getting xp from other than questing. My mains and mage (enchant/tailor) got their levels questing in Cata. My rogue almost got from 80 to 85 picking herbs and doing archeology. My pally and DK quested and mined, and always had a rest bonus to help it along. My shaman did the same with herbalism. I have a warrior next and she will be mining and killing beasts and questing to level. And I always make sure to do my exploring achievement some time before hitting cap level.
    In EQ2 crafting is an alternate way to advance, it has its own level count, and stuff like flying mount can be gained at lvl 85 either crafting or adventuring. So a level 1 adventurer with lvl 85 crafting can fly.

    3. I am ok with people levelling however they like, and again I could see adventuring, crafting and PVP as three alternate systems. But if people are determined to miss some of the levelling experience for reaching elder game, it does not effect my game, unless they expect me to help gearing them up to be able to enter max level dungeons once there -- I pretty much only do that for friends and people my friends vouch for.

    4. Killing stuff I guess, though why should it be the only way :p Solving objectives, reaching achievement objectives, finding places, items and people, creating and building, taking a stance for or against an issue (taking the stance is the experience, not which stance to take, it is a game, there should not be a "right" answer to an issue, when asking the player to take a stance), participating in events, building hubs and communities. Gathering materials. Looting items, like junk rare treasure items sell to a merchant for more than common junk and xp to loot it the first time (EQ2 does that, I like the detail).

    5. I guess, that we are talking raw hours here. Max 14 hours to get to level 10 like the easier intro learning levels, and then a flat 4-6 hours per level sounds about right to me.
    The do 4 quest and kill 20 mobs and now you are level 5 20 minutes into game play does not really work for me - well, on the 10th alt it does, but not on my main.

    I do like perks for having done it before. However much time Carbine makes Wildstar levelling take, I would like alts of the same path already taken doing it faster. I could be sparkly and say I want quests, I have already done on my account to give added xp, but that would lead some to stick to a given road ;-)

    I also do like rest bonus. It helps those who does not log on so often to catch up to friends - though in theory a mentor system with true level equivalent rewards would work just as nicely. It also helps someone like me rotating between alts, so wanting rest bonus is also purely egoistic.
    If there is death penalty I could see it paid off with an amount of rest bonus.

    I do like there to be stumbling blocks on the way, a type of gating that has multiple solutions (questing, crafting, exploring, killing, etc., like turning in an object that can be gained from different types of avenues) to get passed, but makes the player appreciate that they just passed a point in their character life that gave them access to become more besides turning from one level to another.
  8. SiegaPlays

    SiegaPlays "That" Cupcake

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    which game is this?
  9. Treamer92

    Treamer92 New Cupcake

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    It almost sounds like TSW?
  10. SirRobin

    SirRobin Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yeah but TSW had levels, they just called them action points and skill points and stuff.

    I did think that whole wheel thing was neat but I preferred Skyrim's constellations more.
  11. Dyraele

    Dyraele "That" Cupcake

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    The Repopulation
  12. Billco

    Billco Cupcake-About-Town

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    I kinda like having quests and a story to follow or at least, some kind of path to follow where things chain together and make sense.

    Certainly prefer that over the slay 100 bugs, good..now slay 100 more type stuff anyway.

    I don't feel that you should be able to level entirely by crafting or gathering etc as has been done in some games. You get to level cap without having any clue how to hold a sword let alone swing it.

    I am still a fan of a long hard slog to get to cap, so that its a real achievement when you finally get there and then you can start on end-game. Never understood the logic of hitting cap in the first 3 days, chewing through end game content and then hitting the forums <REDACTED>in that the game lacks content.
  13. SiegaPlays

    SiegaPlays "That" Cupcake

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    Yes, I fully agree, something that ties into what your role is in regards to a worlds lore. I prefer questing that makes sense too.
    Well, up to the point where I have done them 2-3 times already, then diverse alternate options to the common quests is nice for a break. I'd still follow the personal storyline (or path) at that point, but replace some of the fluff quests with alternate options.

    While I do not want to put the hammer down and say people simply have to experience their role in the world, I can not say I understand those, who fasttrack their main to endgame without stopping up and smelling the roses now and then.

    As for harvesting, well, xp there would be from the encounter you get from harvesting :p
  14. Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Super Cupcake

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    Well this can be countered with something. I'm thinking something in the line of a crafting character only which is not able to engage in dungeons and/or raids. A non-combat character. The reason for the current leveling content is to learn you how combat works. Basically prepare you for the difficult tasks that lay ahead of you. I think leveling a non-combat character would be great (for alts). But if it is not in the game, so be it. I don't mind that so much.

    Having quests in the game is something that is linked with the fantasy genre. All characters in a fantasy world have a quest to complete. Frodo has to throw The One Ring into the lava to save the world. In a mmorpg there is a main quest too, like in Wildstar, we have to find out what happened to the Eldan. Besides that main quest line we have hundreds of sub quests to make you more experienced and stronger. For me, quests belong in a fantasy-type game.
  15. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

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    SWG.... There are a lot of fans that miss that game.
  16. Kirathis

    Kirathis Cupcake-About-Town

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    I thought SWG had something like that. From what I remember hearing from friends who played it was a pretty good system for the non-combat type characters.
  17. SiegaPlays

    SiegaPlays "That" Cupcake

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    This is where I would like to see 3 different levelling curves, one for crafting, one for adventuring, one for pvp. If you get to max level crafting, but never touch pvp or adventuring, you will still be level 1 in those two and thus not able to enter max level adventuring or max level pvp content.
  18. Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Super Cupcake

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    Each curve could be seen as a skill this way. It would be an hybrid between a level and skill based system. I would dig that.
  19. Dyraele

    Dyraele "That" Cupcake

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    If it isn't obvious from my initial reply above, I would like it too. SiegaPlays' system is close enough to what I would want and they wouldn't have to mix all 3 to get a level, so they are levels on their own. That is basically what I want.
  20. Black Wolf

    Black Wolf Super Cupcake

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    I have the feeling Wildstar will be a bit more conventional. I think it will be something more in the line of WoW. They talking about layers constantly, so above idea(s) would only add more. We have to wait and see though.

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