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Female Armor Aesthetics

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Kahlan, Jan 29, 2013.

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  1. DrThreaded

    DrThreaded Cupcake

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    Oh no, I was solely referring to the cash shop clothing. You know, bikini elves and maid elins killing bosses and such.

    <There was a short paragraph about cloth armor having leniency design wise because it's just cloth and how Tera T14 sets were more protective here, it's gone now>

    ...That's okay forum, it's not like I wanted to post that or anything. Anyways, the only T14 PvP / Regent model set that really is just lingerie armor is the Castanic one, the other sets like this are actually fairly protective for being just cloth.
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  2. Naunet

    Naunet Well-Known Cupcake

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    *takes a moment to drool over some QW on the broker* .... Damnit, Nau, you shouldn't be spending all that money on your low-level alts... stop it!

    Uhm. Where was I? Oh yes!

    Definitely. I hate pretty much every cash shop costume they've come out with. @.@ Not only are they ugly, but they break the entire aesthetic of the game. Hopefully WildStar doesn't fall into that particular trap.

    [edit] Incidentally, cloth QW/Regent/VM/Conjunct on aman is seriously lovely. Excellent character!
  3. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    Choice really is the only solution to the debate anyway. Go with one option or another and you'll have tons of players be deeply upset while others are happy with the options. It takes more development time to give everyone what they want but I think it's worth it in the end.

    I believe to a large extent that MMO gear will never be all that realistic, whether it should be or not. This is obviously the case regarding female armor. Many times, people play games so that they can escape reality or just to experience a fun, new pastime. Stylized and exaggerated armor designs fit this philosophy behind games' purposes very well. This includes the "sexy" armor design that is given to female gear as opposed to how the same gear looks on male characters. Behind this design philosophy is the thought that gear should look "good" or "cool", and thus adds to the exaggerated design of a game's characters and gear. Obviously these terms are subjective, but there are ways to make gear more popular despite this fact. For many, this happens to be the kind of gear that many here in this thread have disparaged.

    In a game with health bars and where characters can survive several bullets and sword-slices to the chest despite gear in addition to fiery combustions, pitching the realism argument becomes a more difficult gambit. This of course registers with arguments about gear's appearance in games. Typically, the standards of "coolness" regarding appearance differ between male and female. While these same gender standards do also differ somewhat by culture, it's important to recognize the audience, which in this case is the West and East Asia. For the most part, these standards are mostly uniform across the board for this audience, thus you get female armor that is sexy and cool while men typically get "badass" looking gear (which can include "revealing" gear as well to make the males look "tougher" and of course more badass).

    I don't think too much realism works in several game genres, and looking particularly at Wildstar, realism would be counterintuitive to the game's focus on zany, exaggerated fun. For that and above reasons, pitching the argument that armor should be realistic struggles when so much of how the game works isn't realistic at all.

    That all said, I still think choice is a great option and allows minority preferences to see the light of day. This is good if the rest of the game can be properly balanced and doesn't adversely affect other important features in the game's design. The argument that SHOULD be pushed forward is that character aesthetics should emphasise choice and shouldn't be abandoned after the game's launched but be constantly tweaked and added to similar to how dungeons, raids, and new PvP maps are added in patches. The realism argument dies pretty quickly since the game's mechanics don't reflect reality at all. As for the objectification/sexualization of female gear, this is fixed by giving players choices while allowing those who do want "sexy" gear for their characters (which I presume is the majority of males who play female characters) to have what they want. If you REALLY want to send the message that women aren't sex toys in your game though, I think including some strong, independent-minded in the game lore would be far more effective than focusing on how female gear looks.

    My opinion and all, but I think the best solution for everyone is choice. :)
  4. Naunet

    Naunet Well-Known Cupcake

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    Yup, but that choice shouldn't just be for females. Males should get revealing armor, too!
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  5. nomotog

    nomotog Cupcake-About-Town

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    Why isn't she more bulky? The males are very bulky, but she is quite skinny.
  6. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    Although I don't think you can sexualize men much just by taking their clothes off.

    There were some "harness" gear items in WoW that pretty much showed the mens' chests that emulated the "savage" or stereotypical barbarian look. It creates a type of badass look that I mentioned in my earlier post but I find it hard to come to the conclusion that a male showing off as much skin as a female is the same thing in terms of how it is perceived and people's reactions to it.

    Outside of that though I pretty much agree. When I RP'd a troll in WoW, I wanted my "beastmaster" to have a bare or mostly bare chest so that he looked like a tribal berserker and a warrior of the wild. It's a look I don't see often in MMO gear design and I think it'd be a nice inclusion amongst all of the "demon" plate.
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  7. Huffle Puff

    Huffle Puff Cupcake

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    My personal fashion icon:

    [​IMG]

    I would love to see light armor like this for spellslingers: reasonable coverage and functionality, yet stylish enough for a stylized game world. Plus, holsters!
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  8. Vanor

    Vanor Cupcake

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    Well to be fair that's fan art, not even official concept art. So I'd guess it's because that's what the artist wanted to do with that image.

    What I'd love more then almost anything... To have a gunslinger type character with holsters that you could actually put your guns into when you weren't using them.
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  9. Naunet

    Naunet Well-Known Cupcake

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    Oh, oh you definitely can. You just need a male model that isn't hulk-hulkster on steroids (i.e. nearly every single male human model in all MMOs ever). Male high elves and male castanics in TERA are perfect for that kind of thing, though!
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  10. Seagrey

    Seagrey Cupcake-About-Town

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    That would work too...
    What I like? I like her modest boob size, her athletic body type, armor is not too skimpy and her overall posture works for me.

    This lady can kick ***.
  11. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    I'm just not all that sure. The standards for what makes women sexy vs. men is just different. It surprises me still to this day that it's so different but it is. So many great looking women end up with ugly, sleazy men. It dumbfounds me.

    There can still be a lot of overlap between the sexes and sexual appeal but there is still a significant difference between what makes men and women "sexy", at least from my own personal experiences.
  12. Apostate

    Apostate Well-Known Cupcake

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    It's important to differentiate between attraction at an aesthetic level and attraction at a social level. Naunet's saying that male characters can be designed with sensual appeal but they rarely are, which is something I happen to agree with.

    If we're going to get into the whole business of why certain people date other people, that's a bit more complex of a topic.
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  13. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    Feel free to elaborate on the social attraction bit as it pertains to armor appearances. I'm not quite sure what you mean by it.
  14. Naunet

    Naunet Well-Known Cupcake

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    As a woman - and I'll admit that different women find different things sexy - this is extremely appealing to me. Also this, and this. And if I'm in a muscly mood, I will drool all over this or this!

    So yeah, entirely possible to make revealing outfits for guys that are totally sexy. The thing is - you need to have a male model that is actually appealing to women first, which... the typical male model seen in MMOs is not.
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  15. Apostate

    Apostate Well-Known Cupcake

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    Your counterpoint to hers was that the standards of attraction between sexes are very different and cited your personal experience (for brevity's sake: pretty girls with ugly guys)as an example of it. I don't consider them mutually exclusive. There are women who are attracted to men at a purely physical level, and there are women who are attracted to men for other reasons. Wealth, power, prestige, compatible hobbies or lifestyles, etc.

    That goes both ways across the gender divide, obviously, but my point here is that these are all alternatives to aesthetic standards, not aesthetic standards themselves. A person might forgive one potential love interest for being a little homely if they're a genuinely nice person with a stable lifestyle, while they might pass over another, more physically attractive candidate that has a bit of a temper and no steady income. And then other people might flip those priorities around entirely.

    Anyways, I have to run for a bit. Social dynamics = complex. Eye candy = simple.
  16. Chomag

    Chomag Cupcake-About-Town

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    So a woman's ideal of beauty in a man is just a woman without boobs and something different in the pants...
  17. Rostinoble

    Rostinoble New Cupcake

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    Omg, yes. I WOULD have to agree with that. No more Elins. No more Elin movie titles or Elinware jokes. I was on the server that pretty much invented the Elin jokes and I couldn't stand it. I made a giant Baraka for the sole purpose of sitting front of the Elin dance parties on my huge mount so no one could see them. They didn't like me very much. xD
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  18. Dumblediner

    Dumblediner New Cupcake

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    I agree, we need more mankinis.
  19. Naunet

    Naunet Well-Known Cupcake

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    What? The guys in those screenshots are quite distinctly masculine.

    Urgh. Your comment right there represents exactly what is wrong with the presentation of women and men in video games and comics. Too many guys are so insecure in their masculinity that looking at someone who isn't steroid-bulked out makes them back up and cry "feminine!"
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  20. Dysp

    Dysp Cupcake-About-Town

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    ..just stepping in to respond about my granok drawing.
    Kind of. It was meant to be a double layered thing. I don't know clothes that well, so I kept it simple. I kept the stomach exposed, well, because she's a rock and thought it made her look more athletic.

    I was just sorting the character out. At the time, I had only seen two screenshots of a female granok, so I kept her more like the Cassian, but taller and leaner. She could be bulkier, but I was picturing more of a lean female granok. She's a ranged class, and bulky didn't seem to fit.

    As for the armor.. why would you weigh yourself down if you fought from range? (+ as said before, I'm not good with armor/clothes).

    Although, drawing a bulky female granok sounds fun now.
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