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Hoverboards!

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Ugh, Nov 8, 2013.

  1. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    If you are applying physics to mounts, generally speaking you will want to apply them to the players also, otherwise you will feel the discontinuity. Funnily enough, this is exactly what Firefall does. Which is why I am confused as to why you did not understand the reference.

    Not trolling. What you described easily turns right into gliders, which brings us right back to flying mounts. Neither of which I want in the game for a couple of different reasons.

    On the contrary, I am fine with hover boards. Its true I did not <Mod Face>Edited for language.</Mod Face>, but really I am pretty ambivalent. What I am against though is adding in these sorts of mini games that do not work. Like the numerous "card games" people want to add to various games *cough* Swtor *cough*. If that were such an amazing idea one would think Hearthstone would have been planted cleanly in the middle of Wow, after all that could be made to fit! When your side minigames are more compelling than your real content, then you have a serious problem. One that means you should be shoring up that content rather than hiding it behind fluff.
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  2. selodaoc

    selodaoc Cupcake-About-Town

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    Without rewards people wont bother. "Player generated content" never works.
    People might live on their clouds believing otherwise.

    This is one of the points where GW2 fails, theres nothing fun to do (ok they added tedious grind without any reward except new look for you gear)
    Without rewards for your time spent, an mmo fails. The more different things to do with alot of uable rewards rewards the better (dont pile it all up in one event)

    I see nothing wrong with it. Aslong as you can win ingame money. Not everyone, including myself, wants to raid 24/7
    Domi Dayglow likes this.
  3. Zephiris

    Zephiris New Cupcake

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    you are trolling if you compare a hoverboard with a flying mount. And if you try to argue that it is a flying mount your just proving everyone's point. Which is that your hopeless.

    But all one needs to do is glance at your signature and it should be clear talking sense into you is hopeless.
  4. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    Then you need to learn to read. I said it brings us back to the glider vs flying mount debate, as that functionality (physics) is extremely similar to it, especially if taken from a height.

    Yes, because quotes from some of the most popular and influential science fiction writers of the 20th century clearly makes me "hopeless".

    Then perhaps you should watch that Extra Credits I linked for Vyver a couple pages back. Simply put, it feels bad. If you are logging into your game, to play another game, you have done something wrong.
  5. Tex Arcana

    Tex Arcana Cupcake-About-Town

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    I like the quotes. :roflamo:

    But wow, this community can be mean over differing opinions.
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  6. Yakzan

    Yakzan "That" Cupcake

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    <Mod Monocle> The argument here has gotten out of hand. Like I mentioned in the AMP thread, sometimes it's better to not reply than reply at all. In any case, keep it down. </Mod Monocle>
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  7. Karl Pedder

    Karl Pedder Cupcake-About-Town

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    Well to be fair most of the unpleasantness tends to come from the very source that one of those quotes in paticular is addressing.......the pervasive and ridiculous premise that everyone having their own opinion is the same thing as all opinions being equal.
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  8. selodaoc

    selodaoc Cupcake-About-Town

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    Hoverboards might it feel a bit...."Kids-Teenage"?
    Maybe its some kind of marketing thing to atract those age groups.
  9. Vyver

    Vyver "That" Cupcake

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    “Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” -CS Lewis



    Hoverboards are awesome for all ages
  10. Antiabz

    Antiabz New Cupcake

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    I'm a grown up....and I'm so excited about hoverboards that I feel a bit sick...
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  11. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    Uhh.... No.
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  12. Vyver

    Vyver "That" Cupcake

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    hoverboards for all ages
  13. Isgu

    Isgu Cupcake-About-Town

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    Right, so I have not read through the whole thread since honestly I really did not want to read through some of these posts /sighface so excuse me if I am repeating something someone already mentioned...

    The idea of hoverboards is very cool however something was missing... a guildie had a great suggestion - adding some inertia in the way it moves, kind of like the Borderlands2 Hovercrafts.(link below) No idea if this might be too much for such a small part of the game but I know I had a ton of fun in Borderlands2 just riding around in these things. Something for Carbine to look into perhaps?

  14. selodaoc

    selodaoc Cupcake-About-Town

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  15. Roda

    Roda Cupcake-About-Town

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    *war flashbacks*
  16. Vyver

    Vyver "That" Cupcake

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    Inertia was broad up at the beginning yeah, mainly because it certainly looks like it has it in the easter egg video. Especially when it turns (when it turns left it slides a little to the right as opposed to just turning left and going straight like a normal MMO mount) and yeah, inertia would be a huge plus when it came to mounts.


    Now, they showed the hoverboard again in the warrior twitch livestream and it appeared to be a more straightforward MMO mount, though it had a sprint and jump/double jump feature.

    They never got it going as fast as the easter egg one though, so I couldn't really judge on inertia.


    Also, they totally screwed up the POWAH line when referencing Back to the future. When someone told them on the stream that the hoverboard could go over water because it had POWAH they instead quoted Palpatine from the Star Wars prequels

    I'm starting to think they're fake nerd boys
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  17. TeoH

    TeoH Well-Known Cupcake

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    Yea we get it, you have a stiffy for Extra Credits, but just because their video makes some valid observations doesn't make it applicable to every discussion, and simply pasting it into a thread doesn't mean you're correctly applying their insight.

    The point of the video is that when your game's appeal depends on a particular type of core gameplay experience, any additional gameplay systems that you force on the player should compliment that experience instead of clashing horribly with it. Which makes perfect sense...

    ..Except we're talking about an MMO here. The core appeal of an MMO is that it provides a persistent world for people to interact in and connect to. An MMO is an online world first, and a collection of little experiences to have or games to play within that world second. In general MMOs don't even have a singular gameplay goal, they provide a world, and then aim to provide as many varied experiences within that world as possible in order to attract as many people to that world as they can, because their real content is not a particular type of game mechanic, their real content is people.

    The Paths concept should already spell this out, but all successful examples of the genre offer many different gameplay experiences to tap as many different tastes as they can. They offer competition against players, challenge against AI, exploration of a large world, lore and roleplay. They appease compulsive collection tendancies and addiction to increasing numbers, they appeal to players who see their avatar as a personification, and encourage people to play dress-up.

    Bioshock has a clearly defined gameplay experience of shootin'n'cutscene'in, where an out of place hacking puzzle makes no sense and clashes horribly with the core gameplay loop. Wildstar already has collection achievements, world exploration, housing, costumes, jumping puzzles, story content, PvE and PvP content at varying levels of organisation and challenge, solo, small group and large group play and carefully distributed Furry fanservice - What exactly is the core gameplay loop in Wildstar that is broken up by having inertia and racing physics on mounts?

    I could move the discussion on to say that making a game out of moving around the persistant online world and encouraging something like racing which is naturally a social event within that online world is a perfectly fitting and desirable expansion of the game's core appeal.... But Gaffney already made that point when he stated that movement makes up the bulk of a player's game time and that making movement more interesting was a great idea for an MMO.
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  18. Xlugon Pyro

    Xlugon Pyro Super Cupcake

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    Lulz
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  19. TeoH

    TeoH Well-Known Cupcake

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    I got uppity in IRC after the stream showed that the hoverboards weren't what I was hoping for, and we got into a bit of an argument about what the mechanical differences would be between what is shown and what was implied by the disclaimer. I didn't really get time to go into detail there so i'm going to rant to myself here instead, as it seems like it's actually topical.

    We already know that WS has some more interesting physics for player movement than typical MMOs, if you've paid attention to some of the movement in gameplay footage from conventions, you'll have seen that there's already some amount of acceleration, friction and so on modelled for the player. Consequences of that being things like the player picking up momentum from sliding around, instead of just having an uncontrollable falling animation on slopes of a certain gradient ala WoW. Or the jump button taking current momentum into account resulting in varying jump heights/distances depending on current player movement.

    So there's already room there for minigames that play with the physics, and we know they're messing with super jumping, low grav and so on. It was suggested that the Hoverboard as shown on stream may have racing style physics and be comparable to the disclaimer footage if you just ramped the speed way up and reduced friction a bit, but I don't believe that is accurate. Hoverboard controls appear to be regular player movement at a higher speed, and from that it would take quite a bit more effort to get racing controls out of it.

    The missing physics piece is the concept of turning, meaning redirecting momentum as you would in a car, or on a snowboard. With what we know about how WS's player physics work, assuming you have the option to fiddle with acceleration, friction and so on, you could increase the speed, decrease the acceleration, reduce friction a bit, and you'll have a character that takes a while to speed up and is difficult to stop once you get going. However you're still only able to move by applying acceleration in a particular direction, you do not have any ability to redirect your current movement vector. If you're travelling North, and want to go East, you have to accelerate from scratch in a new direction, the game as far as we know does not include 'turning' as a concept.

    Reducing friction and acceleration without giving you the ability to turn will result in Asteroids movement, which isn't really appropriate for racing. To support turning you'd need different controls for the hoverboard, presumably replacing A/D with the new turning mechanic, and supporting mouse turn in a similar way to Aion / Firefall gliding. Doing that means greatly limiting the manouverability of the mount, you lose the ability to just point in a direction and go like a player walking about on the ground. Of course that limitation is what creates the gameplay that would make the design fun to drive in the first place, so that's exactly what we want, but it bears mentioning that it's a significant departure from their current controls. You can't just up the top speed and be done with it.

    So it would be quite a big deal for them to cram decent movement physics into the game for certain mount types, but that's what people saw in the disclaimer video, and it came with a teaser that this was a big deal, and after the suggestion that we might see something really interesting with regard to mount types.... We had our hopes up. Nevermind ey.
  20. Vyver

    Vyver "That" Cupcake

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    I just want a mount where if you disembark it while moving you keep rolling forward for a bit.

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