Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Ingsoc, Feb 13, 2013.
And you really believe that this has ANY depth?
It is interesting to see how people felt limited by the number of abilities in GW2 - I actually felt that was good because for once I needed other people and them just being there helped me do other funky things - just pulling them off in time at an appropriate time was a pain. I hope that they can find a happy medium, but I would love them to build in combos using the tells. Nothing like charging through a fire field to freak everyone out as they gain a fire shield lol.
chain system was one of the worst i have ever seen in Mmo gaming to be honest, and i hope that will not be implemented in wildstar...although, i will admit that PvP wise wasn't that bad...
for a game though that has some pve depth, should never be embraced.
Depth ya sure. Some have a little more or a little less depth. Take transfusion, it's really basic being mostly an attack power that heals, but it only heals people who are close to the enemy first. This means you have to think about not just who you want to damage, but who you want to heal. If they don't line up, do you protriy healing over damage, damage over healing, or maybe try to get both by a asking people to switch monsters.
Kitten claws might be a better example of depth because this attack is almost entirely defined by who your fighting. Which telegraph should you use this power on? The biggest one, or maybe the one that deals the most damage? Should you use it on the attack that's hard to doge or have we got that down by now? Your also going to have to coordinate with your team to make sure they know to run to the monster this time rather then running away.
Also take crystal lock. It's a root, so you cast it on the most deadly enemy that is far away or the enemy that is maybe weaker and closer. If you cast it on the close enemy, then you have a easier time to heal, well the far enemy has more potential to do damage. Maybe you have a speed buff and can lay down a path to the far enemy and get the best of both worlds.
I played the beta of Neverwinter recently. The game has some faults here and there, and it sure as hell isn't even CLOSE to Wildstar in what I want from an Ultimate MMO I play for years... But their combat is spot on.
Top notch combat. It feels great, not as floaty at GW2 did. It also has mob telegraphs on the ground which you need to dodge out of like Wildstar. And the on bar abilities? You get 7. That's it! Two for each mouse button with no cooldown, 3 hot keyed to Q, E, and R with cool downs, and 2 powers up top hot keyed to 1 and 2 you can cast everytime a bar fills up.
As you level you get powers here and there you have to decide to slot in, and of course you can slot new things in whenever not in combat.
It's perfect. I have yet to play a MMO that feels as good as Neverwinter combat wise. So, I actually welcome their design choice so far with Wildstar. Sure, in WoW and EQ II and SWTOR I was they player who had my screen full of bars. And I used every darn power sometimes! When GW2 came along, I slowly got used to it, but combat sometimes felt floaty and it wasn't always spot on.
Neverwinter showed me it has nothing to do with number of skills in one fight I can use. It had to do with how tight the combat is coded and designed. I think by allowing everyone to cast while moving every single power it sort of mucked up the feel of combat. You need the right balance of casting and standing still, and being to kite EVERYTHING just gets a tad dull.
I really think Wildstar can pull off better combat than we're used to with a limited ability bar. It forces you to make choices, sure, but trust me... It's a good thing! It will also lead to way more theory crafting I feel, with people discovering ability synergy between previously untried things all the time.
Don't be scared! Embrace the limited ability bar! Once you get used to it, I really think you'll end up prefering it!
could work if you can do them quickly and out of combat as well. Speed buff is important in world pvp.
imobilize though may be to important to keep it for a combo.
cool I was just listing that at the very least I would thing these basic things are important. additional effects or functions of the ability would be nice to have of course.
If I am building a support spellslinger or a cc spellslinger for group play it would have different abilities.
I'm really unsure about the limited action bar. But, I like what this game is attempting to do well enough to give it a go. At least it isn't a HUGE departure from the standard MMO fare like The Elder Scrolls Online. TESO is going to have left and right click combat and no cooldowns - it sounds thoughtless and spam oriented to me. /shrug To each their own.
I use every one of those abilities on a regular basis, or else they wouldn't be on my main action bars.
EDIT - This is from WoW, and obviously WoW is not Wildstar. We have no idea how many action buttons we will have to work with, and only a very limited idea of what skills will be available. I'm not trying to say "This is how many I use in WoW, I need the same in Wildstar!" Not even close.
I'm more or less responding to someone who thinks that people who use the majority of abilities available to them are doing something wrong. In my opinion, people who don't use the majority of their spells and try to maximize their raid utility are the ones doing it wrong. But that's another topic for another time.
I love it! In raids it let's all 3 healers be completely necessary; one has the amazing persistent buff, the other has the CC n the last that amazing debuff.
and in PvP, you attack that stalker expecting him to open with a stun, but instead he opens with 3 layers of dps buffs and completely shatters your strategy!
I think people also forget that many abilities seem to be free form in some regard, so that esper doesn't need single target and AoE necessarily, abilities are a bit if both!
Mmmm. Look at all those tanking abilities. Mmmm. Tanks. I love having to micro-manage buttons too Ingsoc. Comparing Shaman DPS, which largely consisted of Lava Burst spam (before I quit a year ago), to Paladin tanking is... no contest.
Dont forget people the User interface IS customizable as Carbine have already stated with their confirmation of add-ons and the Lua programability of the GUI. I think we will see more options available over time (No Im not volunteering to code for players LOL) so I think its safe to see this as a baseline for now.
If they made the choice to limit the number actions, then I don't think they would let you bypass it with a UI mod.
I hope that gets changed. I much prefer having enough slots to map all my abilities to a key or a key combination over being limited to only a few skills at a time.
They could make the UI dynamic though, abilities popping up for use when the circumstances for their activation have been met (possibly with movable anchors); Tactical strike only showing up on the UI when your stalker enters stealth mode or counterstrike showing up only when your warrior takes critical damage.
i'm not sure how i fill about the limited action bars. In one instance i'm like yeah that could be awesome put more strategy into the game, but I also feel like if I need one extra ability to be successful i'm screwed. Also what if I'm in a group and two, three or (god forbid) all of us don't have the right abilities set for each other hoping everyone else has that crucial one. I mean yeah have more communication, but sometimes there are times when there's no time for communication.
My only feeling about this currently is that I welcome a system that doesn't lead to UI clutter [more than one hotbar feels cluttered to me, even if I enjoy playing the game] or require me to use modifier button combinations [CNTRL+button or ALT+button].
Also, food for thought: none of the replies I've read through described abilities that could provide more than one function depending upon whether your target was an ally or an enemy. Your Healer Esper might not need a damage ability and a heal because 1 ability may do both depending upon what they're targeting.
I think GW2 had the right idea but just didn't execute it well enough. When you incorporate often constant movement into your MMOing, it's going to allow more fancy footwork to have a bar limited to 9-12 ability slots that can be swapped out. I think a happy medium between GW2 having maybe too few and WoW/EQ/Etc... having too many. I think this causes people to get more intimate with their abilies and really see them as potential combos or rearrangements depending on the situation. As long as enough abilities can be obtained so that there aren't immediate cookie-cutter class receipes, I think this will be a good thing. Balance will be the interesting part.
Bla I was meaning to mention that, but I guess I forgot. With fewer powers, you really do what most to include more then one effect. I kind of alluded to that in my healer build where almost all her powers included a heal along with their main effect.
The Wildstar User Interface article,
The limited action bars are not too much of a concern for me but how many abilities will be available at our disposal is.
I think having action bars is pretty fun. This system can be very rewarding to strategic players that plan ahead. Hopefully, this system also supports players raising the bar on their playstyles (me included XD). Yet, all of this could be for naught if there isn't a wide array of abilities to choose from and really make these action bars unique. Else I assume the combat will run very bland and repetitive.