Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Jeremy Gaffney, Apr 15, 2013.
Thanks. From what I understand though is that everyone has access to anything so they aren't really racially exclusive?
I think that's the idea, yes. IMO its quite an elegant solution to racial skils. You can make them as powerful as you want without having people required to pick specific class/race combinations.
Yeah. This worries me. Guild Wars 2 technically had what? 10 hotkeys? 3 for extra slot abilities or class abilities, 1 for an "Ultimate" ability, 1 for a "Healing" sort of ability, and the 5 remaining for weapon based abilities? As a lot of the previous posts mention, having such few hotkeys leads to incredibly dull gameplay based around 'casual' gameplay. From my interpretation, Path abilities and other such things end up being rarely more than abilities used for the quests. They reference testing jet packs as explorers and grenades as soldiers for some missions, but that doesn't mean they're permanent.
Everything else about Wildstar looks incredible, but being restricted to 7 class abilities is something that gives me a lot of concern. Obviously there needs to be a limit so it doesn't end up like how a Priest's hotkey bar in WoW used to be (if not still), but not so limited that most of the combat is 'auto attacks' and telegraph dodging. I definitely hope this changes, since it seems like it is a common concern amongst posters based on reading the whole thread.
People often point to GW2 and the limited action bar slots as being dull or boring. But they didn't really say that about GW1. The action bars are the same size though. The difference is that in GW1 you can slot a zillion different spells. Same with TSW.
Wildstar will let us have lots of options for what goes in those 10 slots. Plus a whole lot of watching telegraphs. I don't think it's going to be a problem. Going for open-minded at this point.
The biggest problem with GW2 is that 8/10 abilities on your bars generally had 20+ sec cool-downs (usually it was more like 40) . This meant that basicly everything but your "auto-atack" would be on cool down at the same time and you would have nothing left to do. TSW has proven to me that 8 abilities can work given the right skills. Would i like to see more? sure. Is it game ruining for me? not really
Yep, TSW actually worked pretty well, though that "8 buttons" turned into 13 by the time you added in heal potion, dodge, Karma Curio, kickback, and stimulant. I'd vastly prefer more than that, to be honest, but it wouldn't be a gamebreaker to me at all if WildStar were similar.
The problem with gw2, as mentioned, isn't the number of ability slots; it's that most of the abilites you get, not to put too fine a point on it, suck.
Most popular warrior spec: greatsword. Most of the time, you're autoattacking waiting for Hundred Blades to come back up. The charge is buggy and gets hung up on everything (I summarily stopped using it after repeatedly missing my target because it turned and ran THROUGH me), the sword throw is only useful for runners, and Whirlwind actually carries you away from whatever you're fighting, so you have to turn around and run back.
This is aside from Banners being summarily worthless, especially an IB build since Regeneration don't stack and Stances being too long cooldown for too short benefits, and everyone ends up a Shouts warrior.
So of those 10 abilities, you get two fun, usable damage abilites (one an auto-attack), a heal, and some utilities that choose themselves. Oh, and a mostly-useless Elite that's always on cooldown.
This isn't an indictment of LAS; just bad design.
No it's not. It's a dumb cop out to racial abilities. Everquest, Everquest 2, Warcraft, and Vanguard did racials correctly. Perhaps Fear Ward in WoW was a little too OP, but for the most part, racials helped the player identify with their character by giving it uniqueness, and by making choosing your race mean something other than just looks.
Everquest 2 has 20 (TWENTY!) races. Here's an example of the depth of their racial system. All 20 races get this kind of unique treatment:
Ultravision - Provides high contrast vision, but washes out color.
Malicious Velocity - Increases Out-of-Combat run speed by 5.0%
Hover - Reduces maximum falling speed of caster when not mounted.
Traverse Shadow - Teleports caster to target when not in combat.
Presumed Brilliance - Increases Intelligence; the amount increases as you level.
Darkened Agility - Increases Agility; the amount increases as you level.
Masterful Sorcery - Increases Disruption and Subjugation of caster by 5.0.
Dark Celerity - Increases the casting speed of hostile spells by 2%.
Ancestral Ire - Caster will Double Attack on 2% of attacks.
Sharp-witted - Increases Ranged and Piercing of caster by 5.0.
Willful Persistence - Increases the duration of tradeskilled potions by 15%.
Ireful Will - Increases Out-of-Combat Power Regeneration of caster by 9.0.
Master of the Shadows - Increases stealth or invisible movement speed of caster by 15%.
Poison Expertise - Increases the trigger count of poisons by 25%.
Hateful Mind - Increases Max Power of caster by 3.0%.
Dubious Focus - Increases Max Power of caster by 1.0%; Increases Max Health of caster by 2.0%.
Elemental Defiance - Increases Mitigation of caster vs elemental damage by 3.
Toxic Intimacy - Increases Mitigation of caster vs noxious damage by 3.
Unyielding Determination - Increases progress by 2.0%.
Skillful Triumph - Increases success chance by 2.0%.
Poison Crafter - Increases the durability gain of the alchemist by 2 every round.
Pursuit of the Arcane - Reduces the power cost of all Sage reaction arts by 10%.
Dark Armament - Increases Metal Shaping of caster by 5.0.
The more I hear about this game, the more I think it's going to make the same mistakes that Rift, SWTOR, and GW2 made. It's going to be another solo-oriented, casual based MMO that offers no character individuality. Everyone can do everything, and everyone can have everything. I really hope they are smarter than that.
This in an OPINION, not a FACT.
I find the racial you listed to be rather boring, i would much prefer having active combat abilities.
Sorry to hear you feel that way. Every game cant be for everyone however.
I'm all for racial abilities so that what race you play has an impact other than visuals. I also believe the paths in WS may help add some uniqueness to the type of character/role you play.
(Btw, Mat'hir, from the sounds of it you might be interested in Camelot Unchained if you don't already know of it.)
Mattie, it seems like everytime you post, you're lamenting that this game isn't the next coming of EQ. News flash: it's not going to be. Everything you hate about this game, I love. I certainly don't want yet another 2% racial (unless it's 2% crit, mind). The only time I notice a 2% difference is in my morning milk; in a game, it's not even worth the bother.
Bottom line: if you want to like WildStar, you'd better start looking at it as WildStar, not Norrath in SPAAAAAAACE! Because the devs don't want it, the fans don't want it, and I'd go so far as to say that everyone who is not you does not want another no-quest, hideous grind, lose-weeks-from-your-life-death-penalty, massive-raids-so-big-they-crash-your-video-card game. Because that kind of game SUCKS.
<Mod Monocle> Please keep the discussion on topic, and just as important, without resorting to attacking others. </Mod Monocle>
Stormtalon (Level 17-22)
PLEASE TELL ME I AM NOT ALONE IN READING THIS AS STONETALON?!?!?!?!?!?!!
lol nope, you're not alone
Appreciate the heads up. I've heard about it, I'm just not a PvP guy.
The path system in WildStar sounds great for making sure a player enjoys his leveling up experience more. But, I don't expect it to have much of an impact on your "role" so much. And I actually agree with them on that. It would be bad design for every tank to be forced into the Solider path for example.
In terms of role, I'm just hoping they don't have Dual Spec, and make Re-Specs extremely expensive. If anyone can switch to a different role with the click of a button, we will see a massive exodus after three months.
Personally, I prefer EQ1's racial set up, complete with combat perks and experience penalties. I figured most people didn't though, so I thought EQ2's was pretty much universally fair. The point was that it's pretty easy to give the flavor EQ2 gave without balancing issues.
Listen, I want an MMO to play. I want one BADLY. All these recent games have been horrible. I hope this game is great, but they're going down the same design path that Rift, SWTOR, and GW2 did. Sure, they've copied EQ2's housing and WoW's raids, which is great, but it all means nothing if you don't fall in love with your character and want to play the game for years. This casual orientation has been proven to not foster long term commitment. A solo based game has an end once the content has been consumed. And solo gameplay negatively impacts an MMO. That's been proven as well.
I'm just sick of the 3 months and bored out of my mind MMOs. And GW2 was the worst of them all. If this is just GW2 with raids and housing, that's not going to be good enough.
None taken. But you're completely wrong.
About what I want, and about what the majority of the playerbase wants. And you'll see.
I don't know if you were around when they added the vampire race in EQ2. They got a unique life steal proc in their racial tabs and because of it many people in my guild rerolled their characters just to get access to a tiny increase in power. The fact is, if one race offers a benefit, even a small one, to a specific roll or class, you are going to see nothing but these combos in end game raiding. I want to pick a race because of its aesthetics, NOT because i need it to heal optimally. (I swear too god, if i had to roll a chua...)
By letting anybody get the same skills just with variable effort, you can still have unique skill sets without being locked to one race.
TLDR: The moment the racial exclusive abilities go past fluff, balance is a problem
<Mod Monocle> Ahem. I believe I asked that the thread stay on topic. I don't like doing it but I will take action if that is not followed. </Mod Monocle>