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Rachel's Racial Roundup

Discussion in 'WildStar Races' started by Steampunkette, Jun 23, 2013.

  1. Nunchi

    Nunchi Cupcake

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    This is why I am still "iffy", this is a passage from "WildStar Wednesday: Exiles United":
    "Many believed the situation hopeless. Even if the ships were repaired and provisions were found, it was only a matter of time before critical systems of the fleet's battered starships began to fail. What they needed was a new homeworld, a place to put down roots before they succumbed to death or destruction in the cold reaches of space.
    And indeed, they might have suffered such a fate had it not been for a human named Dorian Walker. Obsessed with finding the legendary planet Nexus for years, Walker had always been considered a crackpot amongst his friends and peers. Just before the rescue mission on Arboria, he left the fleet in a desperate gamble to find the Eldan homeworld. After weeks of fruitless searching, just as the life support systems on his ship started to malfunction, Walker finally reached Nexus - and soon after making planetfall, he sent a joyous message to the Exiles that he had finally found them a new home."

    I mean did they really have any choice, could they have just skipped Nexus and looked for another planet? Or does it not matter regardless?
    Look at it this way: There is a group of people with no place to go, being chased by a blood hungry imperialist empire and they are literally on the brink of death. All of these Exiles, by all intents and purposes, have done nothing wrong, and just need to recuperate. Does that honestly sound anything besides pure evil to you? Maybe I am being biased and over-exaggerating but this WildStar Wednesday seems to speak otherwise.
    Dorian himself was searching for Nexus specifically, but from what it says here, they didn't have any other choice. They were searching for a home world. This either implies that they had no other planet to go to, or there were other planets but they didn't want to invade them.



    Off-Topic: The picture on the WildStar Wednesday seems to showcase some really cool mid-level/high-level gear.
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  2. Miatog

    Miatog Cupcake-About-Town

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    So having a ruling class who's half Eldan makes the claim distant? Not to mention the Eldan were part of the Dominion till they disappeared, and the Eldan are now gods to the Dominion. It's a good claim.

    This is an interesting idea. I'm pretty much staying out of talk on the revealed races cause it's mostly speculation. But if this is the case, then it could give them a weaker claim to the planet, but a claim non-the-less.
  3. Rumze

    Rumze "That" Cupcake

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    I like the idea that the technozombies are the early right hand men of the eldan but were replaced by the mechari and put on ice by the eldan - discovered by the exiled humans and then joined them.
  4. Eluldor

    Eluldor Cupcake-About-Town

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    Just clarifying some word usage on what has been said, since some people are talking based on misinterpretations...

    The OP said imperialistic Federation much like any group of people that moves somewhere and displaces the indigenous people. OP explains the reasoning. The Dominion was already stated as an Empire, by the OP, as they displaced the Exiles (the indigenous people) on multiple occasions.

    The Exile starting videos has them crash land or shot down on Nexus to only start slaying the local yetis. The Exiles have most likely displaced other native species with a stronger form of civilization than the Yetis.

    Nobody knows all about the native inhabitants of Nexus, so saying Nexus belongs to the Eldan is relatable to saying a superpower like the USA or Russia owns Earth. Going to have to get on Nexus and start exploring, to determine what really went down and how much "power" the Eldan had over the planet ;) .
  5. Skippy

    Skippy Well-Known Cupcake

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    You mean the small faction of the luminai which the dominion decided to put on a pedestal? A lot of that blood is weakened and in some of the cassians, I fail to see how this gives the Chua, most of the cassians or even the draken a "good claim" to the planet. If the luminai wanna go take it back cool, it doesn't give cassians Chua or draken more right.
  6. Miatog

    Miatog Cupcake-About-Town

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    Hadn't read that WSW yet, still catching up on my lore. But still, Walker was LOOKING for Nexus, knowing full well the Dominion would be angry at them moving in there. This actually caused me to lose respect for the Exiles. I thought they had just stumbled across the planet and took what they could get. To be actively looking for Nexus is just asking for more trouble.

    So destroying an ambassador is nothing wrong? Harboring fugitives and rebels from the law is alright? The Dominion has good cause to attack the Exiles, they are not squeaky clean in all of this.


    I don't agree with this. We know that Nexus is the Eldan home world and what little I know of them says they were a unified people. So yes, they did own the planet.
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  7. Rumze

    Rumze "That" Cupcake

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    I think looking for nexus as a way to find tech that let them fix their ships and gain an edge on their rivals is a smart move.
    No one knew where it was. Of course your rival will be upset if they think you found a way to beat them at their own game, in this case eldan tech that they didn't have access to.
    It doesn't matter that the dominion was pissed at them for finding it because the dominion already considered them enemies. Its not as if they were angry neighbours that wouldn't talk to each other and now nexus pushed them into enemy status. They were already at that point.
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  8. Apostate

    Apostate Well-Known Cupcake

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    The Luminai aren't merely "put on a pedestal", their lineage is the Holy Grail of the Cassian faith. Their Eldan blood is what began the Dominion. The Mechari, themselves, are Eldan creations.

    The chua, lowborn Cassians, and Draken are all members of the Dominion. The Dominion was itself conceived by the Eldan, by way of the Luminai and Mechari. The claim is very real.
  9. Eluldor

    Eluldor Cupcake-About-Town

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    I'd agree with you a few days back before "Something bad happened to the Eldan. They didn't just disappear, and the thing that got them is coming for the players."

    So did the Eldan awaken that nasty on their own planet or did it come from afar? I'm thinking they awoke whatever took them out, and then they sealed it away or banished it, but all of their efforts were too late and their civilization fell.

    Their home world just means they're from that planet, and even if they thought they ruled it - the "nasty" showed them what's up ;) I'm feeling like some of the native species, maybe civilizations?, were not on friendly terms with the Eldan either.
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  10. Apostate

    Apostate Well-Known Cupcake

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    This, though, is a legitimate point. The Exiles were already on the Dominion's <REDACTED> list. Really, the Exiles have no reason to worry about the whole "claim" business as it's entirely irrelevant to them if they consider the Dominion's authority illegitimate in the first place.

    The Dominion's claim to Nexus: We have a tremendous amount of history here. This is the home of the legacy that created our cherished empire.

    The Exiles' claim to Nexus: Screw those guys! They're total pricks. Plus, we kinda NEED THIS PLANET TO HAVE A HOME AND SURVIVE, so there's that.
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  11. Miatog

    Miatog Cupcake-About-Town

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    Because they're following the orders of the Iluminai. I don't think the Eldan blood has weakened any if at all. All of the Iluminai are descended from the first Emperor. Every single one of them. At worst the first one or two generations after him had a Cassian parent. Given the WSW where we heard about them, they breed among themselves only, the Emperor's kids probably married each other.

    So a ruling race made by the Eldan, a machine race made by the Eldan, and the fact that the Eldan made the Dominion. The Dominion has a very good and strong claim on the planet.


    Given that I will your argument has a possible point. But, given what we know now, it's a weak one. Simply because, we don't know. You could be right then your argument is very good. You could be wrong and it's out the window.
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  12. Apostate

    Apostate Well-Known Cupcake

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    The native species all appear to be very primitive. Judging by what we've seen so far, anyways.

    We know that the Eldan were -very- advanced in science, they cared a great deal about power, and can be assumed to have had little in the way of conventional morals. I personally think they met their demise at the hands of some "Lovecraft in space" type thing. Delving too deeply into the unknown, etc.
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  13. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    Imperialists in our history did commit atrocities such as genocide, rape, and torture. So did people who WEREN'T Imperialists. The Spanish Inquisition, for example, tortured maimed and killed their own people. Kings and Nobles and Ruffians and Parents of various stripes have also, throughout history, committed all of those atrocities as well.

    The act of conquering a nation usually requires bloodshed and almost always requires cultural assimilation or destruction (Such as Christmas and Easter both having many Pagan symbols and rituals in them). Rape and genocide, torture and other crimes, however, are a separate matter. A terrible and horrible matter, indeed, but they are not part of imperial conquest so much as a crime that often happens in conjunction with imperial conquest.

    For example: A person who steals your money MAY have a weapon and MAY threaten your life in order to coerce you to give him money. That doesn't mean all theft involves weapons and threats to your life.



    The Dominions was built by the Eldan, who were the natives of Nexus. The Mechari were built there, as well, and shipped out. And the Luminai trace their lineage to that planet, as well. So it's fair to say that the Dominion's got a definite interest in the planet, to the point that they could get equity on it if they were to take out a planet-sized mortgage.

    When you take that into account, the Exiles are Squatters. They're squatting in the Dominion's house and the Dominion conquered their homeworlds, but that doesn't change what they're doing, which is conquering someone else's property.

    Again, this isn't a reflection of good or evil on the part of the Exiles. just a statement of fact. And, as was duly noted, it is also inhabited by other intelligent life forms of various stripes. Some of which are native species. If you want to apply cultural destruction, displacement or genocide of natives, and other such events to imperialism then it's very likely the Exiles still fit into the definition of conquest.

    You could break out the imperialist part of the issue with an argument against them "Having Lands" to begin with, but they have been living inside starships and are retaining those places of residence while also forcefully taking lands from other sentient and sapient life forms. In a starfaring universe I think that still counts.


    They really didn't have another choice, no. And that's an interesting case of extenuating circumstances which could certainly temper any punishment that occurs. The fact remains, however, that they're trespassing on another people's property, taking the resources for their own use, and displacing the indigenous life forms, some of which definitely are intelligent.

    Being driven to murder doesn't make the victim not dead, even if it explains the reasoning behind the murder.

    Also, about the Eldan and Dominion claim to Nexus:

    The Eldan started the Dominion. They were a founding member world of the group. They created the Mechari and the Luminai, both of whom can trace their lineage (or manufacturing!) back to Nexus. They hold an ancestral claim to the planet itself, and since the planet was never annexed or otherwise removed from the dominion through war, trade, or treaty the Dominion itself still holds rights to it.

    If the Humans of Earth died in Star Trek instantly, but there were still half-humans and human-designed sapient automatons recognized as people with all the rights and restrictions thereunto: Would the planet suddenly belong to the Klingons? Or would the planet, and all it's resources, still be a part of the Federation's holdings?

    ... I'm am such a dork. Also I love how interesting and involved this thread has gotten! *squee*

    -Rachel-
  14. Nunchi

    Nunchi Cupcake

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    Can't say I agree with the point he 'knew full well the Dominion would be angry at them moving there'.
    Since it not only never said that, but even if it did: This does not change the fact that the Exiles are on the brink of death, they have no other choice. From what it says here, it seems that Dorian has been looking for Nexus long before this happened (go figure, he's an explorer). He knows his people are about to die, as it says, so he desperately tries to find Nexus. The weight of his peoples lives depended on it. I wouldn't judge all of the Exiles for Dorian's intentions.

    For the second point you made, it seems I agree completely. Though if you could provide links (not because I doubt the things you are saying) so I may form my own first-hand opinions, I'd prefer it.

    Though I firmly don't believe and highly disagree with "The Dominion has good cause to attack the Exiles, they are not squeaky clean in all of this." The Dominion have invaded home worlds and killed countless innocent people and will do the same to anyone in the Exiles whether they were fugitives or not. That is clearly not justified. The Exiles never put up banners saying, "have YOU killed someone? Are you a shady fugitive mass murderer searching for a second chance?" I don't think they care about your personal background. They saved the Aurin from being unjustifiably killed and captured.

    The Exiles aren't an individual person, and shouldn't be judged as such. They are a group, and the groups intentions are what matters when judging the Exiles, not the individuals.
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  15. Rumze

    Rumze "That" Cupcake

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    Wait - we know that nexus was the eldan homeworld - but wasn't it their lost homeworld?
    As far as I remember, the eldan expanded out and when the cassians met them and their luminary emperor was conceived it wasn't on the nexus.
    Nexus has been hidden away from everyone for a long time and that's why it was a myth.
    No one knew where it was. Neither the dominion nor the exiles.
    The dominion's claim to it was it was used by our masters or originators.

    Wouldnt it be considered open market to whoever could claim it faster/better/win it? Like salvage from the sea rules - salvage in space - forgotten treasures and planets.
  16. Steampunkette

    Steampunkette Cupcake-About-Town

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    If you want to call it "Salvage" then maybe, but you'd have to get everyone in the galaxy to agree to that definition. Including the Dominion, who would likely label it a Real Estate issue.

    I would label it a Real Estate issue, because that is, quite literally, the best way to describe it.

    -Rachel-
  17. Rumze

    Rumze "That" Cupcake

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    Also aurins were displaced from their world which was scavenged and torn apart by the dominion.
    Granok were displaced because when they said they weren't interested in joining the dominion, the dominion tried to conquer them and failed. The granok who fought were exiled by other granok because they stopped following the way of the stone .

    Very similar to the Aiel in the wheel of time series who took up a sword to defend their pacifist folks and were exiled for breaking the way of the leaf ( the pacifists went on to become the tinkers while the aiel went on to become warriors )
  18. Eluldor

    Eluldor Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yep, this is more important than tracking down claims via bloodlines and mechanical constructs sent to your people. Rights don't really matter if you're going to be fighting over it in the first place. A moral boost to the Dominion and reasoning to put forth resources in the conquest of Nexus, sure!

    Very strong Dominion POV, and that's perfectly fine. And yes, my argument is completely speculation on something that may very well be tossed out the window. I wouldn't have even been thinking about "what ifs?", if that quote wasn't released!

    Agreed, what we have seen is very sub Eldan. Delving too deeply into the unknown works for me on possible Eldan demise. That unknown, or a part of it, could very well be located on the planet Nexus for us explorers and scientists to piece together :)
  19. Rumze

    Rumze "That" Cupcake

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    Its still a lost real estate issue.
    You cant own something you had no idea off position wise or if it was more then just a myth. Yes it belonged to your makers but since they gave you everything they wanted you to have outright ( mechari, other eldan tech , dominion over their worlds , genetic makeup to make your ruling class ) they left something out on purpose, perhaps because it wasn't meant for you.
    I would speculate more but I don't know if the dominion emperor secretly carries keys to the nexus city or something but I doubt it.
  20. Nunchi

    Nunchi Cupcake

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    Wow, I completely agree. Precise and logical. Thanks.
    Learned a lot, too.

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