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Tagging Mobs: First Come First Server, or Does Everyone Get A Piece of the Action?

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Zapp Brannigan, Apr 14, 2013.

  1. Eluldor

    Eluldor Cupcake-About-Town

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    Somebody came to these forums swinging, (forum policy here is to not derail the thread by refuting nearly everything someone says, while at the same time insulting...so I'll try to relate some back to the topic at hand, and not say anything against you :up: since that is reasonable in any discussion).

    I honestly didn't play CoH more than a month. Played with crowd control and mastermind. And the gameplay being different from the norm had to do with rather large amounts of empty space. So where mobs were heavy, people were more likely to group up and fight. Of course, I had limited time with this game, so anybody who spent 1 or 8 years with it would obviously know better. Also the mature comment part had to do with people more likely to socialize, group up, and make up histories for their characters, pretty much allowing more folks than average to RP or get initialized into a RP experience more easily. IMO, the community in this game was different than most communities in other games.

    Maybe a study that would shed better light on this would be an examination of how many CoH players went group or solo for the majority of gameplay. Follow this up with 10 other games. Just from my short time there, I felt like group play had a higher rate than anywhere else. Sounds like you reinforced this with your example earlier of GW2. The WildStar team understands that many players mainly play solo. Many games, including WildStar, have a world that allows players to do that easily. Didn't feel like CoH did.

    If you want forum pvp go to site like mmorpg.com. I have an account there too, same profile name, you can even check out the list of games I've played - since it is a hell of a lot more than WoW.

    And the only reason I mentioned GW2 is because you said "never", which is only the case for your experience. I also provided my server name, because that one is heavy pve (nu-official RP server) It doesn't matter if the groups were about 40% or 60%, it simply refutes your statement. Once again, feel free to respond to everything I've said at length, without completely derailing this :whistling:

    Back to what I originally said, external rewards are poor motivation for grouping, and I felt like CoH had much more going for itself to expand a community and create a desire for people to group - unlike most games. Furthermore, CoH niche crowd isn't the norm for most MMORPGs (IMO), so I wouldn't use it an example of anti-complainers for group rewards :sleep: And to end this properly, all of the older MMORPGs had better communities - so there will be let's say 1000% more complainers about anything today. :p How's that for a %? Hundreds of posts and thousands of replies (if not more) on this topic out there.
  2. Randy Marsh

    Randy Marsh New Cupcake

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    I don't like people stealing my mobs, especially if it's a rare spawn. But I'm just thinking.. what if you finally found that elusive rare spawn that has a chance to drop a super rare mount, but loot is shared as long as someone attacks it with you. What's to stop me from telling all my guild mates to come do a little damage to it while I'm healing myself and keeping it alive. That way everyone in my guild would get a rare mount xD
  3. Lethality

    Lethality "That" Cupcake

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    Well, the drop rate would still be the same... i.e. a .01% chance of dropping at all. However, then, it's divided by the number of people "helping". So, your chances go down to... ridiculously low.

    So, shared tagging absolutely defeats the purpose of finding a rare mob with your group. If a stranger comes along, whacks it once, and steals the mount from your group... not fun.
  4. Tiberius

    Tiberius Cupcake-About-Town

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    Tagging mobs seems to be a thing of the past for non-WoW games. When SW:TOR was released and people complained about the WoW cloning, the only consistent clone-complaint I heard repeatedly was 'tagging is so outdated'. It was one of the most lauded Guild Wars 2 features. Companies are taking notice of this, so I only hope NCSOFT kept it in mind.
  5. Jeuraud

    Jeuraud Cupcake-About-Town

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    Actually you said this,
    ,which does not say that they are poor motivators, but that there should not be any external motivators. I disagreed with your opinion (And still disagree.), and gave anecdotal evidence of my experience in two games that handle this very differently. You chose to belittle the game that favored my opinion, and say that there was a “descent amount” in the other game, which also belittles my observation of the other game. The PvP has not been one sided; just because I choose to swing, and you choose to be passive-aggressive does not change that.

    Now we have both given our opinions on this subject… again.
    Mudfin likes this.
  6. Eluldor

    Eluldor Cupcake-About-Town

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    Well...looks like I did contradict myself by saying external rewards are poor motivation, as I meant the use of external rewards as motivation is a poor method to use. Pretty sure in my later response, I didn't actively seek to belittle the game that favored your opinion. I just explained how I saw other factors, like community, influence the game, in my short time there. If this community was present in most games, views from solo play to more group centric would probably change.

    Everyone getting a piece of the action is an attempt to push people to working together, although the establishment of a group or growth of a community thereafter isn't necessarily the case. In more recent games like GW2 (where most of the group ups in open world are for grinding in Orr), people act differently with groups than what I have experienced in CoH or something like SWG - where you'd come across a campfire, in the jungle, sit down for a chat, and then go hunting or exploring afterwards.
  7. John

    John "That" Cupcake

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    I guess I'm the rare guy who find competition more fun than cooperation, I am definitely in favor of a closed tag system.
  8. Soylentgreen

    Soylentgreen Well-Known Cupcake

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    I actually prefer the closed tag system as well, I find shared tags do encourage hitting things together, but don't actually encourage cooperation. You aren't going to feel any special desire to group with someone with shared tags, you'll most likely never talk and just each go about your business because it doesn't matter if you are grouped or not for the most part.
  9. Zapp Brannigan

    Zapp Brannigan Cupcake-About-Town

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    ^I can attest to that being how I played GW2.
  10. John

    John "That" Cupcake

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    I always felt that GW2 big push on "playing together" was far more marketing than reality. As SG said, I never felt like I was playing 'with' other players, the fact that we were both attacking the same target didn't change the fact that the other player was still a random stranger, and I was having zero interaction at all with him.

    To me 'playing together' means actually playing off each other's skills and working together to beat a challenge that might not other wise be possible.
  11. crowsong

    crowsong Cupcake-About-Town

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    I am generally all for open tagging, but sometimes i dislike it, for example when im trying to farm a group of mobs and people run in assuming they are 'helping' me. Also when my friends or randoms hop in mid fight of an epic mob and they get better rewards then me.. I know its random but i think the highest contributor should always get the better drops when they aren't in parties/dungeons/raids..
  12. moneda

    moneda Cupcake-About-Town

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    On the other hand, the things people are inclined to say to each other when they're not grouped together but trying to kill mobs in the same area can be quite... negative. :D
  13. Soylentgreen

    Soylentgreen Well-Known Cupcake

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    That's true, though in my experience 9/10 I don't have much of a problem, one of us can find another place to farm, someone gets bored and comes back later, or I pick one area of to the side and the other guy takes the other. Few whispers about our luck with whatever we're farming maybe, hell even if some dude gets cheesed I'm farming better than him and tells me I suck that is still more social interaction than I got with people in GW2.
  14. Lsya

    Lsya Cupcake-About-Town

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    I agree. In the past people were so worried about kill stealing...who gets credit, etc. I always felt those systems encouraged people to 'not' work together.

    Going with the GW2 type would really be beneficial in making it so people don't mind helping each other out.

    MMOs need to be more community oriented again. They've changed over the years to promote segregation and elitism. I want to see people supporting each other in their faction. There's a war going on. We need to work together.
  15. Elthic

    Elthic Cupcake-About-Town

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    I really think a closed tagging system is needed, sure it might be a pain questing initially, but who cares if the zone is crowded early on. If I organize a group of 20 people to kill Metalmaw, I think it should just be our group of 20 or so people that get loot from that creature. I don't think its really fair if mr.random walks by when metalmaw is walking by sees metalmaw at 5% hits the boss a few times, and gets credit for killing him, let alone get the loot he dropped.

    So guess this goes into a another factor if you allow open targetting does mean everyone gets their own personal loot?
  16. moneda

    moneda Cupcake-About-Town

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    I support a closed tagging system if the game allows me to roll on a FFA PvP server. :sneaky:
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  17. Kalmander

    Kalmander Well-Known Cupcake

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    That's why I think we should have both, and there is no reason why we must choose one or the other. Have open tagging for quest mobs, regular mobs, etc, and closed tagging for rare mobs, and end game world bosses. Best of both worlds.
  18. salazar

    salazar Cupcake-About-Town

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    Granted, i didn't play GW2, but is there any reason we cant have open tagging like in rift ? Killing a mob grants you the XP (for killing it), kill towards quests/challenges and quest items. But you leave the loot that drops from mobs, coin/gear whatever to whoever had first tag.
  19. Witless

    Witless "That" Cupcake

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    The only reason I am for open tagging is because these games have become willy nilly solo silly ;). The reason open is best here is because the general solo player doesn't care about cooperation or competition in an MMO, or else they wouldn't be soloing. Open tagging keeps my small group from having to worry about hurting the poor solo player's feelings, or making them or us have to wait for a respawn

    If grouping were "forced" :eek: or if a good motivator that is external rewards was used as an incentive to group I'd be all over closed. With closed tagging, as many of you have stated, the competition and cooperation would be key.
  20. rivalcycle971

    rivalcycle971 Cupcake

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    I also think open tagging is a great idea. Helping others can really help build a better community. There's no harm in it, only postitives I think.

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