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The Major Problem with Wildstar is that it will be Too Skill Dependent

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Sandmoth, Dec 28, 2013.

  1. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    Because one follows from the other. The idea of "too complicated" is a misnomer as Eve does a great job of showing. In general Mmo's are highly complex games, forcing you to make a large number of different decisions. To try an say this one is "more complex" is false as the various arguments over las and crafting show pretty clearly. This game is not any more complex than WoW is, though it does rely on slightly different skillsets Ie paying attention instead of spamming 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 while watching tv.
  2. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

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    Personally I think I will do better with action combat and LAS... I was never one for macro's and I liked to keep WoW as add-on free as I could. This left me a disadvantage that I had to overcome with being quicker and more knowledgeable about my class.

    Not having some formula of buttons to push for each encounter sounds refreshing to me.
  3. Xecks

    Xecks Cupcake-About-Town

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    true. though having a rotation does help with min maxing which i like sometimes.
  4. Stich

    Stich Cupcake

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    yeah but hte problem with rotations is they become so stale, you could roll your face on your key-bored and still hit your rotation due macros and keybinds, but thats why i like LAS because you can to some extent make a skill set to your own personal preferences to keep thigns fresh, you may get bored of using Y ability, and change it for X ability and see how you like it better
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  5. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    That only works if both skill x and y fill the same role, which most of the time it won't. There will always be a "best" setup for what you are doing.
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  6. Xecks

    Xecks Cupcake-About-Town

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    ya , theres always a min/max setup . the las system makes it a bit more fluid but theres always an optimal setup . i think it will be just fine though. there is enough complexity that there is some guess work going on.
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  7. Dargenus

    Dargenus Cupcake-About-Town

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    I don't think this will be too big of a problem here... the only concern I could have is requiring too much reflexes, but I think that will mostly be a "problem" in PvP. As long as they don't tie too many encounters to lightning fast reflexes, the content should be doable for anyone who wants to put in the time to learn and/or increase their stats. And I think rewarding effort is a good thing.
  8. Xecks

    Xecks Cupcake-About-Town

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    well i watch livestreams of all the classes in pvp. you can tell the keyboard turners from the people using the mouse. i dont imagine that affecting pve much but i can see the possibility of them adding in something that will test you in pve like a mob that jumps behind you every so often.
    there is going to be a huge difference in effectiveness from a noob and a skilled player.
  9. Dargenus

    Dargenus Cupcake-About-Town

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    I don't see how that's a problem. People are free to choose to use the mouse if they want.
    Sure... have I said to the contrary?
  10. Xecks

    Xecks Cupcake-About-Town

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    it wont be an issue if you are a mouse turner btw. it will be if you key turn. it might even turn alot of people off from the game. people are thinking that if you make the skill difference too high people will get upset and not try harder but i think they just might try harder.

    as for your second thing ,oh no. i was just stating it again :D.
  11. tron850

    tron850 New Cupcake

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    i really hope this a joke. so what you are telling me is this is a game where being "good" makes you "good" and being "bad" makes you "bad" as opposed to a game where being "good" makes you "ok" and being "bad" makes you "ok"?

    every game that has ever been created is just like this. its called a skill gap. the good players will always shine, the bad players will always be ridiculed for being awful and the mass majority which are generally average players will be average. this is no different than any other game out there. this post is just stupid.

    you already said it yourself, the mass majority of people who are going to play this are going to be average to bad while only a small sect are going to be very good, therefore your odds of running into them are going to be slim, where as your odds of running into mostly bads and averages are going to be much much higher.

    your argument defeats itself... this thread should have simply been locked...
  12. Destian

    Destian Cupcake-About-Town

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    Ever heard the expression "Easy to learn, a challenge to master"?

    That's what Carbine should shoot for: Make certain parts of the game easy enough that they're doable for novice players, but challenges to rise to for the most skilled.

    It is entirely possible to have both in the same game...
  13. WavE

    WavE Cupcake-About-Town

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    I don't understand what your trying to say here.

    Are you saying that this is a game where skill does not relate to the power outputted by your character?

    Or perhaps that it does it to an extreme?

    Not sure where your coming and going is all.
  14. tron850

    tron850 New Cupcake

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    i didnt think this was too hard to understand... it was literally laced with sarcasm. the point of that was making fun of the concept the OP was using. he said this game is going to be too skill based. every single game is skill based as i pointed out. no game in the history of games has ever allowed good players and bad players to be evenly matched. the better player wins from card games to mmorpgs. sorry the concept blew past you.
  15. WavE

    WavE Cupcake-About-Town

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    Well I would disagree with many of the points your trying to make I think. Also it was your wording that blew past me. ><D

    First of all, skill given to a player is a design choice, and easily manipulated. Also there are plenty of games which naturally even out player skill. For example tic tac to is a game where skilled players and unskilled players even out very quickly, if you need more examples: certain card games like go fish, rock-paper-scissors (depending on who you to talk to), and my favorite, dice rolling games(think mario party).

    If you need an example on you can mechanically even out two players of different skill here is one such occurrence:

    Player A needs to complete objective A
    Player B needs to complete objective B

    Player A goes first, rolls a 1d6 dice. Player B calls odd or even, if it's the number called Player B gets to reverse roles with Player A. If it is not the number called Player A gains a point. At 5 points a player completes his/her objective.

    But that takes no skill you say? Well that is exactly right, not all games (even competitive ones) take skill. Your local bingo champion or the lottery machine would be good examples as well. Taking skill out of the equation is the easiest way to even the playing field.

    But let's go a step further, how about a game that does take skill?

    Let's use an FPS, they're highly competitive yes?
    Player A must hit a moving target 50 yards away within a 1 second window of time, or else his target will shoot him first.

    Player B must do the same.

    Player A has twice the skill of Player B, but Player B has a weapon which gives him twice the power of Player A.

    Power equals = skill output in this case

    Player A and Player B are on the same footing, despite an ample skill difference.
    (physcial example, the noob tube, but i digress)

    So yea, I disagree with your claims. o.o
  16. Sonntam

    Sonntam Cupcake-About-Town

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    So... you would like to play an MMO that relies more on gear/RNG for victory rather than skill?
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  17. WavE

    WavE Cupcake-About-Town

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    Nah I'm a hardcore skill fan. I'm the guy who complains about auto splitting on starcraft 2, and trains every day whatever game I'm currently into until I'm at least able to deal with the pros.

    My point was that a key part of his argument was invalid, and as far as wildstar you can expect it to have a HIGH skill requirement to be good at.
  18. Merganser

    Merganser New Cupcake

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    It was explained in fairly simple concepts by the OP and the video that you linked.
    To try and put it in even more basic terms, the point was in the "too skill based" part. If the game requires a level of skill beyond the average player's capability, it isn't going to be able to keep itself going.

    All else being equal, a more skilled player is always going to be better at a game like Wildstar. The issue is making sure that you don't tune the game for one skill level, and make it too hard for many, and too easy for others.

    sorry the concept blew past you.[/quote]
  19. Merganser

    Merganser New Cupcake

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    I think that he was just explaining to an earlier poster how you could mitigate skill requirement for games, rather than expressing a personal preference.

    Personally however, I've no issue with gear giving some advantage. Between two fairly evenly matched people, the one who has put in the extra effort to gain better gear should have a little advantage.
  20. Chrilin

    Chrilin Cupcake-About-Town

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    And it's what Carbine has stated is their goal.:) So agreed good sir.
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