Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Billco, Aug 17, 2012.
Hey Scooter, we would love clarification on this if it's info you can release.
I was thinking the exact same thing as JarNod and Black Wolf just last night, after re-watching the F&F update and GameTrailers videos again. A toggle seems pretty ridiculous, and the targeting style looks very much like it depends on the ability. The Esper they use while showing off the FFA targeting is a good example - there's the one ability with the swords flying in front of her in a column, and then there's another where a huge version of her weapon spins in the air before it goes smacking into the target.
Yeah, there's totally a nice warm british beer in it for ya if you do! (and happen to passing by England of course)
Haha yeah, that is tempting!
I think it'll be a case of: Single Target Abilities will be tab-targeted, Area Target Abilities will be aimed.
Movement will probably be WASD I'm guessing, with a hotkey button for GTFOOD!
It'll allow flexibility to switch up combat depending on the situation...
After watching the gameplay videos many many times, I think that it's going to work like this : It's real similar to GW2 really.
Put it this way in GW2 I can tab target and use some abilities that will hit the enemy depending if hes in range or not, but I can also use my AoE abilities without any targeting and still hit the targets in range. Really take a look at how GW2 gameplay works and you'll see it's actually quite similar IMHO.
I wouldn't doubt that WS will be similar to GW2 in some regards... They are both NCSoft titles right?
I'm hoping that WS makes it easier to target for ranged classes and tank aggro pulls than Tera did.
A lot of complaints on the Tera forums (and from my wife) about that.
I like how they are describing targeting but I imagine it would be pretty vulnerable to lag. Never been a fan of tab targeting myself but for the lag impaired its their best shot to register hits.
Tera handled lag reasonable well. (server load definitely affected it)
Even being a classic tab game Swtor has terrible lag issues, although I think that it's more related to their engine than servers.
Hopefully your fears about lag (at least server side) will not come to fruition SirRobin.
(keeping fingers crossed)
*curls up in a ball and crys softly*
I think it would be wild to be able to change targeting systems depending on the scenario presented to you to maximize your efficiency, although I doubt something like that is what the developers have in mind (although... maybe?). But then again, I'm an incessant min-maxer so being able to move back and forth from a strong aoe targeting sytem to a more strict tab-targeting style system makes me all giddy.
If I remember correctly (granted: good chance I'm not remembering correctly), it was mentioned in the GC video on GT that the majority of the combat is aoe centric? If so, the FFT/aiming system seems to be the better choice.
In the end, the thing that i'm MOST interested in is the mention that healing in raids becomes much more about being able to move your raid around into formations. That sounds like it could add some mind-bending complexity to raids!
At least it'll give the healers a good reason to smack some dps around for a change.
Seriously though... I think it's going to add a new dynamic to raids as well.
It's a totally different mindset. If you have played Tera, you get an idea on what I'm talking about. Instead of mindlessly doing your part, you have to play together. Strange in a mmo right? You have to position yourself where you don't take much damage, where the healer can reach you. Step out of combat for a few seconds so that the healer can catch up or reach your position.
In Tera the healing mechanics were clunky and boring. A healer there only had 3-4 healing spells or something. You had paint-over skills that worked decent. And aoe healing circles with a fixed distance. I found it not really hard to heal, it was just boring. People died not because of the healer, but because they were not working together most of the times.
In the end I was playing a melee character. Those classes took major damage. It just couldn't be avoided most of the time if you still wanted to do some dps. You can dodge 80% of the time, but then you do no damage at all. Those classes needed the most heals, not the tank. It was stupid. Every time I saw my health plummet I stepped out and walked to or waited on the healer to heal me. Making his or her life easier. I think it will be easier in Wildstar to avoid damage as melee because of the threat markings on the ground.
In Beta I defiantly going to test the healer mechanics thoroughly. It have to and can be better then in Tera. Watching health bars the whole day is not that engaging either. Hope Wildstar can find the perfect mix.
I never played Tera, but that was more from me thinking the game looked pretty lame (I hate boob-jiggling related pandering) and not really digging Korean MMOs.
With that said, your description of healing in Tera makes me even happier I never really gave it a try! I do wonder about healers and how you can make their classes inherently more interesting, and honestly I think it all comes down to specializations.
Healing classes should have roles just like DPS with single target, multi-target, shielding, hot-based mechanics being especially effective among the various healers in the game.
Similarly the implementation of a quality melee-ranged healer would be really incredible. For example in Rift it was possible to have a shaman build that dealt some pretty sizeable dps while also augmenting her swings with aoe healing + had a number of "oh <REDACTED>" buttons and single target top off and tank heals. Granted, this was not viable in an end-game environment, but when you were going for time-trial achievements, the healing shaman was almost a necessity.
Ultimately I think that dedicated healers will never truly leave. It is simply the most effective method to form groups. If spicing up healing means that we just see less damage, that seems only to dumb it down. I'm completely OK watching health bars and dodging big messes of mutagenic ooze.
BioWare used a from Hero Engine non supported prototype for SWToR [click]. It was BioWares fail, not HE.
I found to heal in Tera actually very pleasant. I have played before Tera a long time only tanks.
Yep.... I heard about that as well. The engine was so heavily modded that Bio couldn't even use updates from HE to fix problems from the prototype.
With Wildstar sticking with the "holy trinity" it looks like they are here for a bit longer anyway.
Yeah your right - apologies to the HE team Its just that BW screwed it so bad the first thought that pops into my head when I hear Hero Engine now, is run.
Gonna play devils advocate for a moment here. Now I love the more complex style, and I agree the healing plan of making your team move into formation for the best heals is awesome.
Those of you that pug regularly. Hell, anyone that has every grouped/raided with anything other than a hardcore raid team will have experienced this.
Half the time just getting people to bunch up for aoe heals during a boss phase is hard. Yelling at people to GTFO of the stupid (ground effects) is hard.
Getting a dps to stay within max healing range, whilst everyone spreads out around the boss. Is hard.
I just don't know. I love the idea but in reality I can see it being just hugely frustrating because people just do not listen. Trying to turn your raid into some kind of diamond formation mid fight so you can throw out the magic boomerang of epic heals just seems impossible.
Rofl. That made me laugh out loud. Like I said it is a different mindset. If people don't want to listen or play together I just stop playing with them.
I prefer playing with guildies. That works way better most of the times. And if they don't want to listen either, after I tell them to shape up. I'm even willing to teach them how to do it better. But if they are not willing to improve, a /gkick is very easy to do. For me quality > quantity.
It's one of my only real concerns about the game so far.
FFT has to be done really well for it to work in a raiding environment. Unfortunately other than actually getting our hands on the game and being able to test it <insert shameless beta invite plug here > It's going to be a long wait to find out.
I had a blast in Tera with FFT. (melee dps) My wife on the other hand was healing and could often be heard yelling (to herself) less than nice things about dps and tanks running away from heals.
Something that does provide a little comfort is remembering the more coordinated fights in WoW. They always took longer but we always learned and downed them. PUG's though..... I just don't want to think about it lol.
You know what it sounds like this system needs? EXTENSIVE TESTING!!! *looks at Carbine* *taps foot*