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Wildstar will fail if this isn't changed

Discussion in 'Guilds, Circles and Warparties General' started by KADAMA, Jan 25, 2014.

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  1. Mellkor

    Mellkor Well-Known Cupcake

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    Mate, Eve online has had a tax system forever and its worked just fine.
    Likewise, if you want to run a guild and trim some of the earnings off the top for your personal treasury why not?

    Guild permissions are going to be so candyland just like every other mmorpg in its class, there really is not going to be a huge chance for guild corruption and espionage outside of what you already see in say...World of warcraft.
  2. Cruxisinhibitor

    Cruxisinhibitor New Cupcake

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    You're worried about corruption and misuse of guild funds? Imagine if people knew about the fraud and corruption that entrenches their lives and the motions of their government on a daily basis. No system will medicate human condition.

    Furthermore, the post is contrived, indirect, and egregiously ill-formatted. I had to read sections over and over just to try to understand what exactly you were trying to get across. The information dumping didn't really aid your cause. You should have spent more time developing a sound argument and structuring it. This made my head hurt.
  3. Felion

    Felion Cupcake-About-Town

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    Let me try to summarize, these are the points you're trying to make: 1) People can get greedy. 2) Authority the security access in the guild should be even across all members due to leaders may succumb to point 1. 3) Guild perks take time and effort to do without necessarily guaranteeing benefits to each individual members due to leaders may succumb to point 1. 4) The game will fail due to these reasons, namely, point 1.

    Now time for the attack. The first point is, well, true. Now the second point is a far-far-far stretch from point 1. Same greediness can apply to everyone, members or leaders alike. If one has to be trusted with the handling of the money directly, it should be the person with most devotion and care for the well-being of the guild --- Guild leaders typically fit that description. If you're talking about a vote system on everything, honey there is a reason why we vote for candidates instead of voting directly on every single matter. It is way too inefficient on so many levels, lack of expertise in specific area, time consumption, varied stake and interest, etc. On the other hand, presidents and political figures get paid, through our taxes, because they (surprise surprise) actually need to work 8 hours a day to do analysis and make decisions on our behalf, and they need to be fed. There is of course a fine line that needs to be drawn between proper wage and corruption, but remember that you have the choice to make a different decision (just like voting for a different political party) should they misbehave or should the system not fit your style personally.

    Third point is missing the objective of guild perks. They are precisely intended to evoke interest in the form of challenge. Just like games. You don't HAVE to play a game, you don't HAVE to challenge yourself in something that you may or may not "win". But you do it, for the fun, which results from pursuit of a goal and the mechanism itself is crucial for our survival and "fun" is the just subjective experience that explains this objective phenomenon. If it isn't challenging at all, well, it often loses the fun. As for each single individual benefiting entirely on every guild decision --- That is not going to happen, by the very definition of "society" and/or "community". Canadian taxes take away 60K from me yet gives some 20K to someone else every year. You don't see me complaining. Because ultimately, it certainly benefits the community as a whole and it will reasonably benefit me in the long run --- at the moment, money is the currency that we're balancing things by, but in the long run the currency will be very different. Happy community = happy me so to speak. If you don't think your guild leader is making reasonable decisions, well, again, you have the power to leave the guild. You don't have the power to access military command (and it certainly should be kept that way), BUT you have the power to vote.

    Your final point, that the game will fail due to all those reasons, all depend on point 1 --- that is, all depends on nature. By this logic, since 1 is always true, your point 4 states that anything that anyone does WILL fail as long as it involves a community of people. If that is indeed the case, then the word "failure" loses its meaning because there is never going to be an alternative state to things, namely "success". So naturally, either your point 4 is logically wrong or we have to redefine failure, at which point you'd have to restate your point 4 as something else. Given that there is no link been given to link these two statements whatsoever, I'm going to conclude that it is more likely that your statement is just wrong, assuming general public definition of "failure" that is. If you want to make a claim like that, better do it properly: you can do it by statistics, gathering and presenting numbers and trying to make a connection between certain activities/features in a game and the gaming population/response. And it NEEDS to be on a large scale, with PROOF. Or, you can do it empirically, by defining your vocabulary in rigorous and philosophical terms first in order to isolate the problem, followed by a socratic dialogue -ish point by point logic structure that can be critiqued and verified by the audience. i.e. what do you define as failure, how does one person's behaviour translate into community outcome, are these terms independent of other variables, is there a NECESSARY causal link between them, etc.
  4. Deltre

    Deltre Cupcake-About-Town

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    Can we just /endthread please?

    There's no discussion, the OP lost, and I'm starting to feel bad for how efficiently his argument was torn apart and rebuked.
    Ianpact and AverageZero like this.
  5. Sockz

    Sockz New Cupcake

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    Making this quick, If I just joined a guild and I can have access to perks that take a long time to unlock, I could care less what the GM does with 5% of my 2c. It isn't currency I will miss or is being taken away from me.
  6. calebrus

    calebrus Cupcake-About-Town

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    [nitpick]
    Stating that you could care less implies that you care to some degree. The phrase is "I couldn't care less," meaning that it would be impossible for you to care any less than you do right now.
    When you say you could care less, you're saying that you do indeed care.
    [/nitpick]
  7. Voison

    Voison Moderator • Foxy Cupcake

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    <Mod Tail>
    Closing thread... So pointless.
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