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Will Wildstar be a success?

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by LifeIsShort, Jan 20, 2014.

  1. LifeIsShort

    LifeIsShort New Cupcake

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    When you talk about a MMORPG being successful you have to compare it to the only succesfull MMORPG which is WoW. Either you like it or not you have to admint that it did something that nobody else has done after them.

    Everything that I am going to talk about is in regard of the westerm MMORPG community and market. In Asia and especially in South Korea where 2 out of 3 people are gamers, where they treat their professional gamers like superstars and where NCSoft was born, things are so different that their standards don't apply here in the West. Games like Lineage, Lineage 2, Tera, Aion, etc, are judged of how they performed here in the West.

    The thing is that WoW came out when the MMORPG industry was way different than it is today. Games back then were way more hardcore and unforgiving towards the player. Despite the fact that Vanilla WoW was more hardcore than WoW is today, it was still way more casual that the rest of the games of it's time and it kind of invented handholding. I am not saying that it is a bad thing, it revolutionized the whole leveling process and made it way more accessible towards the masses while still retaining the fun factor. It was the next logical step in the MMORPG's evolution and if Blizzard hadn't done it somebody else would have. It took a whole genre of games that were catered towards a small hardcore percentage of the gaming community and managed to make it appealing to the whole of it.

    Now the problem with WoW is that it has stalled for the past 5-6 years, it hasn't done anything groundbreaking to renew itself. Every two years it releases the same template of an expansion (new race or class, higher level cap, and another series of raids and gear tiers). It pulled in the large casual crowds but also the hardcore gamers, with the years it has shorten the gap between them. The casual gamer of 2014 is way more experienced than the casual gamer of 2004-2005, but WoW for the sake of subscriptions is still getting dumbed down. They did it in the past and it succeeded but it won't ever succeed again because they "transformed" the whole MMORPG playerbase. The other problem with WoW is that it has grown old, even if it innovates itself it will still be the equivalent of the action figures that you played with as a kid, at some point you grow out of them.

    They had this successful business model that worked perfectly for them and they managed to earn colossal profits, they find that trying to tinker and change the formula of their game too drastically is way too risky. And I understand that from a business perspective. Blizzard wants profits. So why risk innovating and spending resourses for research and development on WoW and either keep it alive for another 2-3 more short years or on the other hand kill it before it's time. Blizzard knows that doing nothing different than before will still make them money while WoW is slowly dieing.
    In 2003 there where like 8 MMORPGS you could chose from, after years of watching Blizzard thrive, other companies also wanted to dip their hands in the honeypot, around 30 to 50 MMORPGS came out in 2013 of which only 2-3 where probably made by large companies. Most of them die months after release. They have ALL taken stuff from WoW (the same way WoW took from EQ and small stuff from other MMORPGS through the years), they have all tried to put in some minor innovation and they have all failed. Others try to go down the opposite path, to be nothing like WoW and they also fail miserably. Don't get me started on GW2, I could rant on everything that went wrong with it for hours, both game-wise and playerbase-expectation-wise. I know that games like Rift still have a large amount of active players but their numbers are nothing in front of the 7 million subscribers that WoW still has.

    Players through the years, after playing their first MMORPG and after playing another ten games following that first one, have been let down, while acquiring small "exotic" tastes from the huge variety of MMORPGS that they have sampled. They are each looking for an MMORPG that will lure them in and fill them with awe just like their first one did, and simultaneously satify their other preferences that other MMORPGS provided them with in a mix-and-match kind of way.

    Another thing that WoW didn't have to put up with back in the day is that marketing was way more easier back then. It had only a handful of competitors, the only fanboys it had to put up with were a small amount of EQ fanboys to todays standards, it didn't have to be tagged as a WoW-killer and live up to that name, it couldn't even be called a WoW-clone, you didn't have thousands of gaming sites and bloggers and streams reviewing the game for you. The whole MMORPG community in 2014 has been disappointed again and again after trying new games which has led to a new phenomenon of gigantic proportions, players tend to research everything about a game not only before they buy it but before it is even released. This has led to HYPES, they can be positive or they can be negative, they can make a game or they can break it to a point of no return.


    =======================================================================
    TL;DR: If WoW wasn't the first mainstream and succesfull MMORPG to set the bar there would have been another MMORPG. The key is to satisfy all types of players, PVPers, raiders, soloers, crafters, roleplayers, hardcore guilds, lore fanatics, but to also draw in the crowd of first-timers. Not to only draw them in but to keep them playing by having fun. The next MMORPG-king will have to manage to put up with a whole lot of competition and thrive against them, with better gameplay and with better marketing. It will also have to maintain a positive hype around it's name not only before release but also for a long time after the majority of players have reached endgame.




    Now I am finally going to talk about Wildstar and my personal view around it. I fall into the the type of 2-3 hours on weekdays and 10-12 hours on the weekend type of player, I enjoy raiding, pvp, soloing and crafting. I have played most of the big MMORPGS in the last 8 years since I got into this genre of gaming.

    I first heard about Wildstar a couple of months back, not anything actually about the game but only that it was published by NCSoft. The problem is that I have a history with NCSoft.


    Lineage 2 being my first MMORPG (which I loved at first) that is way too hardcore. WoW was my second one which I loved but it was a difficult transition for me coming from a Korean grinder with an open pvp-pk system full of politics and drama. I later bought into the Aion hype which I thought at the time was an amalgamation of L2 and WoW, I was wrong. Aion was a cool game, different from anything else at the time, it never actually met up to it's promises, time limited flying combat sucks and it was still a korean grinder. After that I spent a couple of years jumping from L2 to WoW back and forth, I stumbled upon Rift and DCUO because I was looking for a satisfying game that kind of felt like WoW. I bought Tera which is another korean game with cool graphics and a new type of action fighting system but with . I later bought again into another hype which was the whole GW2 story which I won't be commenting on. After that I spent 2 years jumping MMORPG-ships and researching and googling for a game that I might actually enjoy again.

    So naturaly I thought that Wildstar would be another korean grinder with cartoony WoW graphics or just another GW2-type-story.

    Wildstar is the first game for which, although it hasn't even been released yet, I have done research upon it and have googled stuff about it and have spent hours upon hours of watching streams of it's first goddamn 15 levels, and have tried to put together what endgame will be like with the whole Elder system.
    I have learned that the actual developer of the game is Carbine, NCSoft is just the publisher, a group of people that left WoW 8 years ago and didn't want to have anything to do with it (probably because of issues with where the game was going and I believe that we all saw in the last couple of years what Carbine already knew would happen). I also found out that Carbine is very picky about it's employees and that it sought out to get the best of the best to get the job done. Wildstar has been in development for 6 to 7 years just so they could code their own engine to run the game, to research and learn about what players really want, taking parts from other games that worked and adapting them to their own style, tinkering with them, adding new stuff, taking well-researched and planned risks but risks nonetheless. Wildstar is their baby and I can see that they are really trying to make the best game possible and that they are actually putting together the formula for the first true WoW-killer, and I know that NCSoft can also see that.

    One of the reasons GW2 sucked so badly was because NCSoft rushed ArenaNet to get the game "ready". I believe that NCSoft is seeing the actualy potential Wildstar can have if they let Carbine "do their thing". Which is another reason Wildstar wasn't heard of until a year ago, they didn't want to get the hype going on from too early and they didn't want other companies to be properly prepared for when the bomb drops. Wildstar is going to be released at the prime of the playerbase's hype and they will manage to steal alot of players from other games aswell. What they also have going for them is that Blizzard-fanboys now have to wait until 2016-2018 until Blizzard's "Titan" project emerges because the whole development process for the game up until now has been scrapped.
    At the moment I am waiting for a beta-key to fall into my hands so I can actually try the game. In theory, Wildstar up until now, has satisfied everything on my checklist of what I expect from a game that I want to play, and also everything else from the checklist of what I believe a game needs to be well-rounded and successful. I am still a college student with not that much money to spare so hopefully, as I have heard, I will be able to try out the game when open beta starts one month before Wildstar's actual release. I really hope this game meets up to all of our expectations, but from getting burned in the past I suggest that you all also get a taste of the game in Open Beta before buying it.

    Just remeber that WoW didn't get 13 million subscribers in a day or even in a month, it took them some time. Judge Wildstar by how much you will enjoy playing it. If you really love it, stay faithful to it and sooner or later the subscribers will come. If everything goes well it will either be the new MMORPG-king and the first true WoW-killer, or at least it will split the market down the middle which I also find to be a tremendous accomplishment.

    Alenaar likes this.
  2. teh_ninjaneer

    teh_ninjaneer Cupcake-About-Town

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    Stopped reading right here. Didn't even bother with the rest of the novel you wrote.

    That first sentence is incorrect, so I will just assume everything else is wrong.
    Nyxis, Vossler, Lsya and 10 others like this.
  3. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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    Topic has been done to death not only on this site but every other game site on the web.

    Are you that bored?
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  4. BamSlam

    BamSlam New Cupcake

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    Not if they keep catering to the MINORITY like they have been with some problems
  5. LifeIsShort

    LifeIsShort New Cupcake

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    Well it's your loss...

    But honestly stop kidding yourself. If the best an MMORPG can achieve is what WoW did which is over 10 million paying subscribers over the course of 5 years, then yes you can safely say that it has been the only successful MMORPG here in the west, not as a game but as a product. It is like disregarding the existence of multinational and multibillion corporations like McDonalds or Coca Cola and considering that best you can become is the equivalent of Tim Horton's. Playing a game that you enjoy and that you know will still be there in 10-20 years time with a healthy amount of players is priceless.

    Or you can go to play one of the numerous games that have gone "free-to-play" with "pay-to-win" mictrotransactions, that are steadily losing their playerbase, knowing that the best guilds/players have already left the game and all that you are left with are some non-factor scraps who inherited their characters/items and are given the impression that they are good players. Games that you can't play to their full extent because of the lack of players to actually raid or have a healthy ingame economy, rulling out the possibility of progressing your character or of ever achieving anything of worth for yourself. Games that will have empty servers in 6 months from now and that will probably shutdown in 1 year.

    You sir want a game as successful as WoW was/is, the only problem is that you want a game also worth playing and that is what we are all hoping for here with Wildstar.
  6. Dargenus

    Dargenus Cupcake-About-Town

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    Who the hell knows.
    If you want a game that caters to the majority, you should probably go play this.
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  7. BamSlam

    BamSlam New Cupcake

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    Sorry let me rephrase that.
    If they game keeps catering to ......... it will be bad

    <Mod Tail>
    Yeah... Lets not talk like that around here. Thanks
    </Mod Tail> - Voison
  8. Domi Dayglow

    Domi Dayglow Super Cupcake

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    I.....really don't see this thread going anywhere in the neighborhood of good anytime in the near future....
  9. Alenaar

    Alenaar Cupcake

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    I myself, no matter how I actually like Wildstar, am having problem believing in its predicted, sometimes even promised, success. I am glad that somebody is bringining this - bit more sceptical - topic.

    At first I would like to say that I am WoW player, since its release, nearly all the time. I had couple moments when I quitted to play other games I believed are going to become new "games of my heart". Every single one of them flopped. I also am person with loads of time thanks to certain health issue that hold me in my house for many years. And I am putting most of this time into computer.

    Now, or should I say since 2011 I am looking forward Wildstar as my exit option. I am more afraid of it then excited. I really do not want to put my time with high hopes into something, just to unsub couple months later with itch on my mind and crawl back to WoW saying "I WILL NEVER LEAVE YOU!" again.

    People might say what they want, beauty is in eye of beholder, but for me it is much easier to believe Blizzard then NCSoft and their "servants" when it comes to MMO.

    Couple months ago, I would probably go to WS without hesitation, but announcement of Warlords of Draenor and Carbine being not willing to give me beta key to strenghten my trust in their product, also as pushing release from expected Q4 2013 onto this "somethingQsomething 2014 we want to release awsome game" is putting me on fine line between these two games and giving me a lot to think about...

    Than again most people around probably do not suffer of such thoughts but I could believe that there are more of players with this "Why to go there when it might suck" philosophy..

    And yes, how can I believe that I am not going to spend my money and time on product that might be running out of fuel quite early, as I have done many times before, once again...

    DO NOT HATE ME! I love you all. I am not looking to appear as jerk or idiot, actually I would be really happy if somebody could help me assure myself by bringing points of view or details I might have missed ^^
  10. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    Op is bored and ignorant to boot. For someone to buy into that much forum backwash that with even the most basic of logic you must question (ie, if all of these mmo's "fail" at 50m+ to produce, how do they keep getting made?) then at best he is willfully ignorant. Quite easy to argue ignorant to the point of stupidity in fact.

    Op, if you really are interested in learning some stuff, feel free to ask, I will link you to several sites/articles etc that all show pretty clearly that much of what you believe is frankly unbelievable.
  11. BamSlam

    BamSlam New Cupcake

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    This game is gonna be the next TORTANIC and you'll feel silly for getting so mad
  12. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    I am "mad" at the general stupidity being displayed, not at anything that has been said about this game.

    If this is a "Tortanic" situation then it will be for completely different reasons. Even then, calling Swtor a failure when its still in the top ten for earnings worldwide is foolish at best.
    Kataryna and teh_ninjaneer like this.
  13. Mellkor

    Mellkor Well-Known Cupcake

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  14. Deavon

    Deavon Cupcake

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    You sir just made my day :roflamo:
  15. teh_ninjaneer

    teh_ninjaneer Cupcake-About-Town

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    Pretty sure I made good use of my time by not reading all of your original post. As your forum name states, life is indeed short. I saved myself some personal grief, eye-rolling and a few sighs by not reading it all. And I saved money on my car insurance.


    Your understanding of economics and business is extremely flawed.

    Not every product has to be Wowcraft, or McDonald's, or Coca-Cola to be successful. I prefer Aunt Mae's homemade burger over that Big Mac anyway.

    By your logic, every movie released each year would need to be either the flashy summer blockbuster, or the end-of-year Academy Award contender. But that's obviously not the case. Low-budget films are released all the time. Some are successful and make profit, some are not. Some even win an Oscar.

    But these movies get released because people enjoy making movies.

    Same way with video games. Some guys like to make them just to see others play and get some enjoyment.

    It's a hard concept for some people to understand.
  16. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    The fact that the OP just posts every single post on other forums aswell.......that's just seeking attention.

    Then there is the other facts that the OP is to ignorant to face the fact that his OWN definition of ''succeeding'' is just plain WRONG!!!
    Your definition = ''succeeding means you have to be the best of the best!''......in case that means your life itself is a fail for you are not the best of the best amongst the human race (and no neither is anyone on here).

    Then the third fact that the OP after seeing so many people state that, still not noticing his own error/flaw....that's double the ignorance.

    Tell me OP, how do you expect people to take you serious when all you do is post stupid things and don't take any lessons from what other people say? Ofcourse they will say ''hard'' thing to you, just like I did now.....but it's just because you can't seem to see it at all.

    That first sentence contains so much fail that it should be banned. People who really think that are.........there are no words for it......it's so disapointing to see people like that.

    Weither it will become one of the greater MMO's out there? Who knows.
    But will it succeed? I'm pretty positive towards that, for succeeding the game would mean that they earn money off of it. What they most likely will. I don't see how Carbine would lose some serious cash on this ''project''.
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  17. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    The problem lies in the fact that the OP just doesn't know what ''succeeding'' must mean...

    I say this is his definition:
    But by this that means pretty much anything in his life is a freaking fail......(as is in most others their lifes according to that).

    His post is clearly from someone who wants to talk smart....but not realising he makes flaw after flaw.
  18. Ghillie

    Ghillie New Cupcake

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  19. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Kataryna likes this.
  20. ImpactHound

    ImpactHound Cupcake-About-Town

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    Nothing wrong with being wordy, but you could split the original post into about 8 different threads and discussions.

    I wouldn't classify GW2 as a failure, it did quite a bit to shake up the market on what features needed to be updated. Belonging to multiple guilds and socially friendly events and rezzing without needing to party were a big deal to me, and the bi-weekly updates keep me checking in.

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