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You get your last ability at 31. Then what?

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Vyril, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    Read my last post.

    They were talking about balancing and tweaking how they will always be working on balance. But the small changes with tiering and amp are nothing to look forward to for 20 levels.


    This is correct / incorrect. You will earn points for tiering after 50.



    yes but they are included in the in the ability list that you have at level 1. Which show a total of 30 abilities and the last is at level 31.
  2. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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  3. azmundai

    azmundai Well-Known Cupcake

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    maybe ... or maybe I just don't know what you are expecting here. it is what it is. there is plenty of information about how you can improve your abilities (and more to come via amps), which you just dismiss as not what you want ..
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  4. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    What I expecting is for 20 levels i get higher impact rewards.
  5. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    Actually it is different. I stated NO where that you stop getting abilties at 31.

    Thanks for the link though. Everyone should read that too.

    EDIT: Obviously you didn't read any of the posts. I love the LAS.
    These are close to the same thing but one is about progression and the other is about lack of choices.
  6. Haversham

    Haversham Cupcake-About-Town

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    Excited? No. What excites me is progression raiding. Leveling is just a means to that end. I was pointing out that character progression still occurs past level 31.

    What it seems like to me is that for the period from 32-50 your character is going to be experiencing the most gains in stats, probably through AMPs. Whereas levels 1-31 will give you the tools you need to play the game properly. Think of it like an introduction to the class for the first 30-ish levels, then a maturation of that class in your hands to level cap. I think it's a nice division personally.
  7. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Oke, I thought you meant you don't get any AMP points after 31 (which I founded strange) but now I get what you are saying exactly, and yes that's true.
    HOWEVER!!!

    What you don't seem to get is that some abilities get aditional effect through tiering + AMP'ing, and then i'm not talking about a 5% dmg increase.

    NO!

    Example:
    A straight up damage spell can get a 1-2 sec stunn if tiered/AMP'ed in it.

    In other games you would have a seperate ability to stunn someone, this time you can make a combined spell that deals damage AND stunns. So we can even consider this a ''new'' ability.

    And this happens to more then 5 abilities per class......can you imagine 10-15 possible abilities that can get additional effects on par with seperate spells in other games?

    So that makes the bridge of 31-50 not so big since you can get 10-15 ''new abilities'' (it can be called new, since in a lot of games there are spells that are exactly the same as a weaker spell but they have that extra effect and suddenly they count as another spell).

    31-50 = 19 levels
    minus the 10-15 = maximum of 9 levels without anything new (ability wise).

    Now.....I wonder.....is that a long time? Not really....

    Some of those ''bigger effects'' that can be considered making it a ''new spell'':

    • Adding a 70% movement speed reduction snare to a pure damage spell
    • Allowing movement while casting with a spell
    • Adding a knockback to a slow spell
    • Giving strong debuffs to attacks
    • Giving a healing aspect to a pure dmg spell (I see this being a ''new spell'' for a more hybrid build)
    70% movement spedd reduction is in a lot of games just a spell on it's own. But here you can ''add'' it to an excisting spell.

    TL;DR aka Main point:
    People often underestimate the effects of tiering + AMP'ing! The effects can be far greater then just your basic + % damage (yes those are in too).
    The effects they sometimes give to a spell would be considered a spell on their own in other games.
    The gap from 31-50 is not as big as people think, and the Tiering and AMP'ing will constantly make you have to reconsider your current LAS settup because of the new possibilities in comboing spells and the usages for the situation.
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  8. azmundai

    azmundai Well-Known Cupcake

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    idk what to tell you, most level rewards consist of rank 4 (instead of rank 3) <insert spell name here> anyway .. its just a different implementation.
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  9. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    I see where you are coming from. The issue is some players don't need 30 to understand how the class or game works. Questing content doesn't need much in the way of abilities choices if you provide relevant options. You make it sound like that Player A can't learn his new ability well enough if he got at 45 instead of 25. On the flip side of that wouldn't you like to have something new to "figure out" at 45 instead of nothing? That 3% crit increase at 45 doesn't seem all the engaging.

    Also most of your perfecting of a character comes in the form of dungeons. Which at max level becomes Heroic and not normals. That's where all the real work is. That's where you will need to refine your character for raiding, solo instances, shiphands, etc.

    I would say any person that plays W* long term will be max level longer than leveling up. That's where players learn to use their character. When they have gear and time played.

    Basically W* is front loading all your character advancement in the first 30 levels then it gets stale afterwards.

    I'm not hating on the game. I just would like to see an explanation, because currently I'm not a big fan of this.
  10. Convicted

    Convicted Super Cupcake

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    I did read the entire thing, and you may be right on the LAS part, but yes it does look very much like a continuation of that thread, in fact Extatica's reply's are almost identical and Jeuraud replied with similar comments including screenshots.
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  11. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    See I don't see these "new abilities" because when I look at them.

    I see things like

    Cooldown Reduction
    Increased Channel Time
    Ignore 25% Shield.

    These aren't even close to new abilities. (http://www.wildstar-arkship.de/actionsetbuilder/en/)

    Maybe if they gave an ability that only hit 1 person before now hit 5 and increased the size by double and lowered cooldown. I could say that's a different ability but nothing comes close to that.

    Everything else is just minor change on the core ability.

    Also you're not really getting these after 31. You can still acquire them pre 31 just not as many at one time.
  12. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    Except what I'm talking about in THIS thread is why don't we get abilities after 31. Not we need more abilities.

    Close but not the same.

    Both subjects bring up questions that I like to discuss.
  13. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Please answer the orange question first.....if you have answered it with ''yes'' then there is no point in going on.


    I used my examples to make a point.....they are ALSO IN THERE!!!! adding a 70% slow to a dps spell ISN'T just a MINOR change.

    If you really think that a 70% snare is a minor thing.....then there really is no talking to you. I can point you to an X amount of games that have ''slow'' spells as ''normal'' spells for it aint a ''minor'' effect.

    If a warrior used his jumps and you just jump out and slow him for 70% for a few second you completely shut him down for that time. That isn't minor!

    Also, please tell me, since it seems that i'm missing that part or I need to clean my glasses....WHERE is the AMP system in that link?
    Do you even know what the AMP system can do to spells?
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  14. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    Ok let me back peddle then.

    Majority of them are minor. Also Half of the AMP and Tier system is in the first 30 levels anyway.

    Let's clear this up a bit too then.

    They're still no NEW abilities. They're altered abilities. Some minor some Major. The problem is you can technically gain any of them prior to 32.

    After 32 you get nothing NEW.
  15. Bnol

    Bnol Cupcake-About-Town

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    The front-loading could also be for testing purposes, especially considering level caps and resets that happen a lot in betas. They need to get those abilities tested by as many people as they can in as organic a way as possible for tuning purposes. You could easily stop getting abilities every level after 20 and spread the acquisition out to 50.
  16. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Oke please explain some things for me, since you are saying strange things.

    Do you consider the following spells in WoW to be ''completely different spells''? So ''NEW'' spells.

    Frostbolt
    Fireball
    Lightningbolt
    Shadowbolt
    Wrath

    Healing touch
    Greater heal

    Just asking to confirm something :up:
  17. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    Yes, 2 spell icons 2 spells. The effects are similar but they are not the same spell. They are 2 spells.

    Also this is a bad choice of spells since you use multiple classes.

    For the hell of it use.

    Fireball / Pyroblast
  18. azmundai

    azmundai Well-Known Cupcake

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    good point, they are definitely even better than new abilities. who wants a new ability that does a similar amount of damage, or takes a similar amount of time to cast when I can cast my abilities faster or for more damage instead?
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  19. Vyril

    Vyril Cupcake-About-Town

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    I agree they are better. I enjoy the LAS, AMP, and Tier system very very much.

    But why does it stop at 31 with primary abilities?

    Testing I can get behind. This would probably be the closest thing to acceptable without them giving us more after 31.
  20. Extatica

    Extatica Super Cupcake

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    Let's say I go with you and (i'm really making my own story), let's make my story into a game.

    I make a 1 healing class with 2 spells, here are some stats:
    Spell 1:
    Healing: 3296
    Cast time: 3.0
    Mana cost: 842

    Spell 2:
    Healing: 3006
    Cast time: 2.5
    Mana cost: 659

    Would you consider these spells completely different?

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