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Your thoughts on "breakout gameplay"

Discussion in 'WildStar General' started by Enkidu, Mar 29, 2014.

  1. Bloodclott

    Bloodclott Cupcake

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    You guys are not going to like later levels then. Right around level 25 the mobs get stuns and gap closers that they usually immediately follow with a telegraphs that can gib you if you do not breakout them fast enough, although I did hear the devs might adjust that.
  2. durabis

    durabis New Cupcake

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    It took me a while to get used to the idea, since I'm used to just sitting and waiting for the cc to finish. There were a couple of times when I was lying on the ground like a fool, basking the the light of the enemies' telegraphs, before I remembered I could just dash to my feet.
    The stun, as people have said, is different. It's the one you have the least control of, since you can only reduce it's effect, rather than overcome it. As a result, it can be more frustrating than the others. I think it is worthwhile having it in there, because it's good to have a cc that gives the cc'er that bit of extra control. And it is balanced somewhat by the fact you're not generally going to be using multiple stuns, but would instead be using them with other forms of cc.
  3. Jeuraud

    Jeuraud Cupcake-About-Town

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    A twitch reflex...what twitch reflex is there that automatically causes you to react to a stun generated on a computer and then find the correct key without fumbling around. Hells, even in real life and death situations people freeze up and/or fumble around; that is why there is so much emphasis on training if your going to be put in those situations routinely.

    If you mind lock, or cant find the correct key then you take the full CC.
    The training part is overcoming the mind lock, and finding the key every time. If you can't do this your going to be eating Red and your going to be dying. Your talking from theory and I'm talking from real world.

    I.e. The first stun I encountered was so short that I did not even have time to think about reacting, but it did make me think about stun breakout, so when I encountered a longer stun I was at least looking for the correct key during the stun. After that I started thinking about key placement, and training myself to find the correct key, and after a few times of sometimes finding the correct key and sometime not I decided to cheat being I have a G13 and put my 'f' key where I would not be fumbling for it. Of course I'd cheated from the beginning by macroing my 'f' key so that all I had to do was press and hold it. Unfortunately my macro never activates the 'f' key on it's own; I have to react to the stun and then press the key.

    Again a good player will 'learn' to overcome the Mind lock and find the right key and reduce the amount of time they are in a stun by half, which will allow them to get out of the Red.
    There is no more illusion about this, than activating a dash to recover from a knockdown.
  4. Enkidu

    Enkidu Cupcake-About-Town

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    It is an illusion friend, and while this may come off as harsh, please do not take it that way. All my points are based around competitive play, where players do not rely on "looking" or "thinking" about key placement. Being as you can change the key to whatever you please, muscle memory kicks in and proceeds with the stroke.

    Funny thing about keybinds, after awhile you should not even have to look or think about what is bound to what on the keyboard, you simply know the placement if each ability to key. The thing is a "good" player has nothing to overcome, they will simply play around the shorter stun duration nothing really changes, that is the point I am trying to make. By making it one persisted key, and capping the strokes it limits control and freedom since all "good" players will be doing is playing around the shorter stun duration, and with that in mind still get off attacks while the person spams their key.

    It may not be that way for you since you have to "look" for the correct key, but for many "good" players that is not the case, they already react the moment they see the stun.

    As Livin pointed out it does what it is intended to do, create the illusion of control, which seems to make people happy since they are simply not eating the stun per-se, but personally I rather have the control and freedom of being able to disable not shorten the duration of a stun be it on a limited cool down like a trinket. I understand both sides of the coin, and while it does bother me, I am already use to it, will I ever grow to love the system? Too soon to tell, but I simply cannot help that they are limited the control of the players in the higher bracket of PvP to please the larger player base because as Livin pointed out simply not many understand that CC is needed in an MMO, it plays a major role.

    So while you may buy into the illusion and not see it for what it is, many have, and only time will tell if the change they make it feel as if they player has more control. Personally if they made it a key sequence I think I would enjoy that more since at the very least more thought goes into that to a certain degree while still reflex based, if you know they keyboard placement, still a lot better, then hitting ` with my pinkie and allowing my macro to handle the rest.

    Once again I might just be an odd ball, please personally I cannot see someone fumbling over trying to find their spam key, but I also like to play mushihimesama and ikaruga for fun, and in reality those games come down to memorization of the level.
  5. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    You already have effectively 2 easy ways to break cc, and depending on amps/team potentially several more. Many of the cc's are broken with dash, and everyone gets access to a cc break on a short timer (often with significant bonuses if you tier it). Many healers get the ability to give fellow teamates Interrupt Armor and there are several amps with either removes the first with its own internal cooldown, lessens the duration, or reduces the chance of them landing at all. If you don't want to deal with cc you really don't have to all that much.
  6. Enkidu

    Enkidu Cupcake-About-Town

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    This is all true, but the point I am making is that the spam key to shorten the duration of the stun, does not change much of anything expect keeps your fingers busy if you so desire. The intent of breakout gameplay was to give options to the player to maintain the sense of control even while stunned. Being as they are reworking it, only time will tell how the rework functions, but in the current state, spam f requires very little thought and can be played around with ease.

    If they made it a sequence, like witcher 2's brawling mini game, something other then one key... I could see how that keeps the player engaged. I just do not get how people can really think spam a key requires training of some kind. I do not have an issue with CC in the game or how it functions, what I have an issue with is the spammy nature of their current breakout for stuns, it is hardly interactive nor does it really change much. At the very least a sequence would mean for whatever reason the person who is able to quickly navigate the keyboard gets out sooner. Sure this "may" suck for those with gamepads, so it is far from perfect. In general CC in the game is not so bad, just I do not buy into the whole interactive gameplay while stunned when it is just spam a certain key.
  7. azmundai

    azmundai Well-Known Cupcake

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  8. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    The problem with sequences and the like becomes attention. Its great that you can follow a fight and still be able to switch attention to differing sequences, most people can't. Look at how disorient is handled as an example. The amount of mental attention required for it is rather small unless you are trying to still play perfectly, but even then in most situation perfect play is not required.
  9. CriSPeH

    CriSPeH Cupcake-About-Town

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    I agree with this.
    To the point that even mashing the F key takes too much of my mental attention away.
    When I get stunned I just look at it as an involuntary pause in the action, as if I was playing Mass Effect or Fallout. I can't do anything so I take the few seconds to access my situation and plan my next move.
    Judging from how many players spamroll directly after getting released from stuns makes me think that the majority is already mashing a key when they are stunned anyways.
  10. Livnthedream

    Livnthedream Super Cupcake

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    Not to mention how many people still haven't realized how good moo's are.
  11. Bnol

    Bnol Cupcake-About-Town

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    Stun just needs to be press and hold, since that still allows those with a better reaction time to get out sooner. Right now people are just mousewheeling or using peripherals to get to the spam cap.

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